Buying a USED DSLR - what to look for?

Hi All. I've been shooting underwater for a few years now using a Canon Powershot A80 and it's likely that I will upgrade to a DSLR in the near future. Having read a lot about what I will need such as a housing, strobes, ports, lenses, etc I'm sure that purchasing a setup will be a significant investment for me. Although I'm excited about the prospect of a DSLR setup, I'm always looking for a bargain and I don't want to end up spending more that I have to on it, which is why I plan to buy a USED DSLR.

Being a DSLR virgin, I'm quite clueless about knowing what to look for when purchasing a used DSLR. Assuming that I've done my research and already know what camera I want (for example a Nikon D80), and that all the accessories are available for that particular model on the market. What do I look for when purchasing a used Nikon D80? What are some specific questions I should ask the seller about the camera and why? How do I judge the overall condition of the camera, other than by how clean it looks on the outside (i.e look at sensor? shutter count? etc?). What are the telltale signs of severe wear and tear? What are things to avoid?

I'd hate to buy something only to find out that it's flawed in one way or other because I failed to check the camera thoroughly beforehand.

Please share your experiences and/or advice.

Cheers!

That's always tought to answer depending on who you buy from. On Ebay you are at greater risk of either being screwed or getting a stolen unit, but not all the time. Buying from WP members is usually safer and also buying from a place like Backscatter or MCD in San Diego are very safe bets, although you'll pay more. However, remember that a crummy looking cosmetically inept housing will work just like new, so don't necessarily let the cosmetic piece bother you. It's an issue of o-ring integrity (which can be serviced to new condition) and electronic functionality and reliability. Light & Motion housings are more cluttered with electronics versus Subal housings, for example. That means more can go wrong in the field with a lot of electronics than a more manual system. You also want to consider ease of use and knob position (ergonomics). Most housings today are pretty good in this arena. If you want TTL then you have limited choices like an Ikelite system, which is less expensive than all other comparable housed systems, but has TTL capabilities if you use their strobes (some other strobes work too).

1. It's usually good to ask how many dives has the housing seen

2. Has it ever been flooded? This is important because some housings can be simply wrinsed out and dried, then it will still work. But hidded salt invasion will fuc... it up in the longer term. So this is critical to ask, and if it has flooded, were the electronics replaced and the housing o-rings serviced?

3. Depending on your strobe you use, you must find out what bulkheads the housing has. If it is wired for, say, and Ikelite and you want to use a Sea & Sea strobe, you may have to have new bulkheads installed at a nice added cost.

4. Ask for the serial number in advance. If they refuse to give it to you, jump ship. Not worth the risk.

5. Ask specifically what accessories come with the housing. Some people buy used housing "assuming" something comes with it. I once sold a strobe on ebay and clearly said this was for the strobe only. The dude was furious after he got it because there were no strobe arms and no sync cord with it. Get the facts straight way upfront as to what is and is not included.

6. Is there a manual?

7. Make sure the housing is specifically for the D80. Don't buy any bullshit that it will take the D80 or the D100 or the D70. It's hogwash.

8. Ask what strobe arm connectors it has, whether ball joint or dovetail etc. This will help you select the right strobe arm connectors.

9. Make sure there is a leak detector, as these can save your trip and camera. You CAN still get to the surface if there is a leak without ruining your camera and housing, so I consider leak detectors SOP for housings.

That's about all I can post now cuz I gotta go to work. If I think of anything else I will post it.

Best of luck.

Joe

Joe has covered a lot of good information.

If you want to buy a used camera and housing then you probably should look for one of the older models as the D80 is brand new and housings are only just now becoming available.

For example, you can get a killer deal on a D70s and housing either here or on Ebay. It's not a brand new camera, but because of the digital replacement curve, you can probably get the D70 setup for HALF what you'd pay for a new D80.

I recently bought a RebelXT on Ebay. It cost $400. You can pick up a used Ikelite housing for that camera for just a little more. Not bad.

Cheers

James

When I evaluate a used item I always look for signs of abuse. Stuff like excessive chipped paint on the housing, good condition of wiring, check for bent sync circuit pins, look for salt trails inside the housing. Check for "crunchy" sounds when pressing the housing buttons which is caused by excessive dried salt or sand packed in the controls. I had one housing that came in that was leaking because the controls had so much sand pakced in them that when the tech took out one of the shafts sand came pouring out!

The most common problem I see is corroded sync sockets. This is caused by removing the sync cord and allowing water to drip into the socket or poor o-ring care. Then the user sticks a sealed sync cap on the wet socket and puts the housing in their closet for 6 months. Then they decide they want to sell it and you have a sync socket that has had salt water sealed in it for 6 months, and you can imagine what that will do for the electronics. Defintely test the sync circuit with a strobe to make sure it is working properly. Also remember that a corroded sync socket may work today, but can fail from slow growth corrosion tomorrow.

For cameras, I like to look at the over all condition. If it looks dirty and beat up, they probably didn't take good care of it. Look through the viewfiner. Do you see dirt or dust on the mirror? Look at the sensor with the mirror up. Is there dirt or dust on the sensor? Are there scatches on the sensor? Depending on how dirty the sensor is you may want to send it to Nikon or Canon to have the sensor cleaned. I suggest this because if you go to clean the sensor and you scratch it, you are SOL.

Sorry if I have scared you! The good news is that housings can be reapired. An annual service will take care of the controls, this can run between $275-450. Sync sockets can range from $175-275 each, and a complete circuit replacement can run as much as $700. You should take this into consideration when looking at a housing.

Something else to consider is if you can get used ports, strobes, arms, etc. Most people only sell off their old camera and housing because the all of the other accessories such as ports, strobes, arms, lenses, will carry over to their new system. Most of your money (sometimes up to 75 percent) will be going into these accessories that you may have to buy new. In some cases it may make better sense to bite the bullet and get a new camera and housing because the cost difference may not be that much if the used accessories are not available, especially if you are unsure about the condition of the system you are buying.

Good luck in your search!

Jim

Thanks guys for the much needed info. Although I initially intended to ask about the camera, the info on used housings and accessories has raised many more considerations than I ever imagined. I must admit that looking for used D80s is turning out to be a lot harder than expected due to its recent introduction to the market. Also, my location being in Malaysia just makes it that much harder to look for a local dealer in new DSLR housings (let alone used models), but strobes are not a problem to find in this part of the world.

Jim's mentioned a few other things about annual housing maintenance costs, which to be honest, really did scare me a little. I now have to do a little bit more research on the convenience factor for having the housing serviced.

What are some other recommended websites I could go to to look for used items apart from eBay?

I might add that, in my own experience, very few people have their housing serviced annually, if at all.

As long as you are diligent about pre-dive and post-dive maintenance, you shouldn't expect to have many issues.

Phish...

Another thing to consider is that when you add up all the things you'll end up buying to house a DSLR, you're going to find that saving a few hundred on a used DSLR body is just a drop in the bucket. Housings, ports, lenses!, domes, extensions, strobes, arms, etc... $$$$...

And as others have said, the D80 is relatively new so I wouldn't think there's that much of a discount on a used body.

edit: oh one more thing since you're in Malaysia. Try hopping down to Singapore. Camera prices are pretty good down there. Or if you happen to be flying through HK as well.

Mike, i find Singapore to be quite pricey, as far as camera gear goes. Even HK wasnt cheap when it came to u/w gear, although i've only been to that shop off Kowloon.

Phish - as pakman said, buying a used DSLR will only save a small amt if you buy rest of gear for cheap. You'd be better served trying to get a used housing as well. Invest in strobes, arms, etc and upgrade housing later.

Cheers,

Vandit

What are some other recommended websites I could go to to look for used items apart from eBay?

For camera and lenses, check out nikoncafe.com, fredmiranda.com, and Nikonians.org - all have very active classifieds. For underwater stuff, this site is your best bet - try a WTB ad and see what happens.

Just FYI, I'm going through the same pain you are. I'm just starting to house a D80. To be honest, if I hadn't already bought the D80, I wish I'd gotten a good used D70 (or fixed the broken D70 I had), and bought a complete used D70 housing setup from someone - there's a Nexus D70 setup in the classifieds right now, as a matter of fact. WAY cheaper and easier than the D80, for which the housings are all new, and largely back-ordered. Hey, as a matter of fact, want to buy a like-new D80?

I always tell my friends who want to start Underwater Photography that the Nikon D70/D70s/Canon 20d/Rebel XT, route are the best way to go.

If you are in Kuala Lumpur, you could probably look up Divers Den (PJ). I saw an advert there for a complete D70 U/W system for sale...

Cheers

Another thing you can do is find someone who is looking to upgrade and is traveling to your area. Sometimes it makes sense for the person to dive with the gear one last time, download all the photos, sell the gear and go back with some cash and much lighter suitcase! I've considered it before but the timing never worked out right . . .

Mike

Another thing you can do is find someone who is looking to upgrade and is traveling to your area. Sometimes it makes sense for the person to dive with the gear one last time, download all the photos, sell the gear and go back with some cash and much lighter suitcase! I've considered it before but the timing never worked out right . . .

 

Mike

excellent idea... in fact if any fellow Wetpixeler happens to be traveling through Hong Kong and wants to part with their mint condition Canon 5D and housing (preferably a S&S so i can reuse my existing ports...)...

:D

DSLRs are essentially similar to film SLRs - but can be checked much quicker. Given your location, I'd suggest buying from a reputable dealer and checking on their returns policy and warranty on used equipment before buying. When/if you get the DSLR the first think to check is the sensor - shoot a plain smooth (preferably grey) background and then open the file and check for smears/scratches on the sensor by racking up the contrast) - sensor damage will result in an expensive and potentially uneconomic repair bill. Dust is not a problem in that it can be cleaned, but sticky residue or physical damage are a real problem. Most other repairs are more likely to be economic (I bought a used Canon 20D privately recently for a price that made havings its power circuit replaced and it fully serviced very economic).