Video camera and housing. What do you think?

Hi!

I am a dive professional and technical diver but when it comes to cameras I am a newbie

I am interested in the SONY HDR-HC7. Can CMOS keep up with the "old" 3CCD technology? Is it even better? (The SONY guys says so of course) or just better than older 1chip technology and one should still aim for 3CCD?

I travel alot and have looked at this set up http://www.gateshousings.com/HC7.html

Is this pure hobby stuff or can quality be good enough to broadcast (with lots of good will of course )? I understand that there are MUCH better cameras for this purpose but is this even in the ballpark? I have seen rather dodgy underwater videos on Historychannel etc.

I will do dive videos for jolly snorklers,waving mums and dads, cavedocumentation,icediving and deep wreck expeditions so I need something in the upper hobby range but still good enough for semiprofessional imaging.

Am I even close?

 

Rodge

Gday Rodge

It still has yet to be proven how well 3CMOS is to a 3CCD camera underwater, but my feeling is it will not be as good.

 

I do know that a 3CCD is much better than a single CMOS underwater though when dived side by side in the same conditions. However the single CMOS can put out a nice picture under the right conditions.

 

To get the best stuff out of a single CMOS, you need to be able to have manual control on the exposure as well as manual control of White Balance. The little camera's luv light as well.

 

It all boils down to you needs and budget.

Single for runinng around on boats shooting day vids.

Larger 3CCD or 3CMOS for better quality.

 

Wags

I wish there was a housing for this camera... http://www.camcorderinfo.com/content/JVC-G...ions-Review.htm

 

 

Rodge

 

 

 

 

Gday Rodge

It still has yet to be proven how well 3CMOS is to a 3CCD camera underwater, but my feeling is it will not be as good.

 

I do know that a 3CCD is much better than a single CMOS underwater though when dived side by side in the same conditions. However the single CMOS can put out a nice picture under the right conditions.

 

To get the best stuff out of a single CMOS, you need to be able to have manual control on the exposure as well as manual control of White Balance. The little camera's luv light as well.

 

It all boils down to you needs and budget.

Single for runinng around on boats shooting day vids.

Larger 3CCD or 3CMOS for better quality.

 

Wags

Was offered this package...

1 st SONY VX-1000E 3 ccd videocamera

1 st Sea & Sea VX1000 Pro UW house.

2 st Sea & Sea 0,5 wideangle lenses

1 st Hama 0,7 wide angle lens

2 st Sea & Sea wide angle ports

1 st Macro-lens kit

 

Is it way to old or still going strong?

 

Cheers

Roger

 

 

 

 

 

I wish there was a housing for this camera... http://www.camcorderinfo.com/content/JVC-G...ions-Review.htm

Rodge

Roger,

 

The real question is do you want to shoot in widescreen HDV or in 4.3 DV ?

 

For the simple tourism / souvenier imaging almost any single chip ( CCD or CMOS ) DV or HDV unit will do.

 

You might need consider the importance of various features / functionality given the nature of your intended usage. Most souvenier videos are shot in an auto everything mode ( Nick , Mark & Mike are of course the exceptions ...... ) or at best with focus locked.

 

In my view a wide port , manual focus / focus lock and a flip style CC filter are the most impotant things. Manual WB is also desirable but is not always utilised. You might also need to think about service needs and availabilty of spares locally.

 

If you want to shoot in widescreen (16:9) HDV any of the available housings for the HC5/7 from Gates , LMI or Amphibico will be up to the task.

Roger

That VX1000 system you listed is in Standard Definition. The other cameras you have mentioned are HDV based (but still able to shoot SD). They are about 10 years apart in technology.

I think it's best you first decide whether you want HDV or DV before you start on selecting cameras. DV is easy on computer editing whereas HDV requires a bit more modern machine (especially with the newer intermediate codecs like Canopus HQ and Apple Pro Res).

Another consideration you may wish to consider is the depth rating since you will be using it for wreck documentation.

I think you need to do a technical checklist on needs, must haves and can live withouts and most importantly, your budget. The advice of Mr Mooney is on the money.

The consideration of CMOS vs CCD is useless if you don't know which format you want. CMOS are all in the HD(in various codecs) camcorder variants.

Don't forget that the Sony DCR VX1000 was top of the hill for several years but is really ancient by today's standards even for standard definition. The color resolution of the Sony 900, 950, 2000 and 2100 beat the 1000 hands down.

Steve B)

Don't forget that the Sony DCR VX1000 was top of the hill for several years but is really ancient by today's standards even for standard definition. The color resolution of the Sony 900, 950, 2000 and 2100 beat the 1000 hands down.

Steve B)

 

Is the 950 still in production? If not, which one has replaced it?

I am not buying a HD camera but will go with a 3CCD kamera in stead.

I seem to have problem finding a camera between hobby 1 chip cameras and the 2100 for example.

What is in between?

 

Cheers

Rodge

Roger,

 

Sony have not offered a 3CCD midrange camera since the TRV950 / PDX10. This camera was replaced by the single CMOS HC1/ A1 HDV camera.

 

The HC1 was replaced by the HC3 which has since been replaced by the HC5/7.

While all of these camera's are HDV they do have the option of being used in DV mode.

 

They would have the added advantage of being new and under manufacturers warranty.

 

In the interest of future proofing the footage you intend to gather you should give serious consideration to your acquasition format.

Hehe Mr Mooney... HDV on tape will be dead in 2-3 years... if not sooner.

The future is now.

Mr Wong - You are absolutely correct.

 

That said 16.9 / HDV footage will be lot more usable in the future than some of the glut of 4.3 footage that currently exists.

 

I think Roger can spend his money most wisely by investing in todays current technology / camera / housing than by saving a few dollars and buying a dated unit no matter how good it's condition.

Hehe Mr Mooney... HDV on tape will be dead in 2-3 years... if not sooner.

The future is now.

 

Well only if the cards cost $5 like tapes do.

And Blueray disks cost 50 cents and burners $150 for storage of it all.

Then you have to wait 30+ mins while it burns it all to a Blueray DATA disk as well for storage.

 

Anyhow HDV/16.9 is the way to go as once you start watching 16.9, you will hate 4.3.

Well only if the cards cost $5 like tapes do.

And Blueray disks cost 50 cents and burners $150 for storage of it all.

Then you have to wait 30+ mins while it burns it all to a Blueray DATA disk as well for storage.

 

Anyhow HDV/16.9 is the way to go as once you start watching 16.9, you will hate 4.3.

 

 

Hi again!

So there is no midrange 3CCD from Sony? So I would be stuck with something like the http://www.gateshousings.com/HC7.html .

I really dont want to go down that track when the CMOS chip is suppose to be so much weaker then the 3CCDs

There are no clear yes or no's I guess.....

So which is the cheapest 3CCD from Sony then I wonder...

Thanks for your input

 

Rodge

Well only if the cards cost $5 like tapes do.

And Blueray disks cost 50 cents and burners $150 for storage of it all.

Then you have to wait 30+ mins while it burns it all to a Blueray DATA disk as well for storage.

 

Errr Wags, once memory cards hit 64GB and more, even if they cost $400, it'll be much better than tape. How many digital cameras have sold vs video? Cards are the future and we won't need to buy 20 cards like we do tapes. 2 will last a few years, something you spend on tapes 80 tapes for 80 hours. In the long run, it's cheaper and more stable.

Harddrives will be in the TB range for under $300 in a few years. BD and HD-DVD are intermediaries as the internet takes hold.

 

Roger

I think you have to be realistic about your aims and budget. You also have to do a lot better research. There are other brands besides Sony which are just as good or better in many ways. I cannot stress enough that you have to first decide on your budget and needs before you look. If you do a search in the forums, there are cameras from Canon and Panasonic as well. The Canon HV10 has the highest resolution of any 1 sensor camera and rivals many of the 3xsensor cameras too. And that's a CMOS sensor, so don't discount it because Sony's version is purportedly lacking. On the other hand, it is also VERY relative on what is good or bad picture. You may well find 1X CMOS sensors are more than adequate for your needs.

At last the issue of budget addressed first instead of lustful, bankrupt inducing indulgence...

 

Budget, budget...BUDGET.

 

Dive safe

 

DeanB

Hi again!

So there is no midrange 3CCD from Sony? So I would be stuck with something like the http://www.gateshousings.com/HC7.html .

I really dont want to go down that track when the CMOS chip is suppose to be so much weaker then the 3CCDs

There are no clear yes or no's I guess.....

So which is the cheapest 3CCD from Sony then I wonder...

Thanks for your input

 

Rodge

The cheapest (only?) 3CCD from Sony is the FX1. The HC5/7's are CMOS as is the FX7. At $3700 retail it's not really "mid-range" though...

 

http://www.sonystyle.com/is-bin/INTERSHOP....mp;Dept=cameras

Err yeh I agree on just having two cards instead of lots of tapes then but storing stuff longtime on a mechanical device (Hard Drive) not too sure I would want to do that.

 

Roger

Another thing you may like to know is the smaller cameras have a smaller FOV (Field Of View, picture width) than the larger ones. Our Sony A1 (16.9) has a FOV when in the EVO housing the same as our Sony PD100 (TRV900) 4.3 in the Navigator 900 Housing.

 

O fun fun fun......

 

EDIT..opps I had DOF....

... storing stuff longtime on a mechanical device (Hard Drive) not too sure I would want to do that.

My entire archive is now only on hard drives. One near-full internal 500Gb and a copy on an external 500Gb which also gets taken on the boat as my capture drive. Just bought a third 500Gb to keep a 2nd backup offsite. My set of 12 backup tapes I wrote with Scenalyzer must be 2 years out of date by now.

Yikes....I would back it up to tapes if I was you just in case.

All drives will fail in the end, they have to as they are mechanical..everything in the world mechanical eventually breaks down, plus they are driven by electronics as well.

Yikes....I would back it up to tapes if I was you just in case.

All drives will fail in the end, they have to as they are mechanical..everything in the world mechanical eventually breaks down, plus they are driven by electronics as well.

Well Wags, tapes have a lifespan and can go funny too, especially in humid conditions. I reckon having 2 complete backups on hard drives including one that is offsite is pretty safe. Having said that I might make one final set of tapes of my SD archive. Apparently the HDV .m2t files that I'm archiving with Womble MPEG Video Wizard are not even compatible to write back to tape, but I've never tried writing them (or in fact any HDV) back to a tape (if I ever actually licence any of my HDV it will be supplied on optical disk or hard drive or just upload).