"Supermacro" with consumer digi?

Hey all,

I have found it difficult to get close enough (<3") to some subjects to fill the frame with a standard or WA setup on my CP5000. I am wondering if anyone has tried using the TCE2 (2X teleconverter) with diopters inside a (custom?) Ikelite port (shooting a CP 5000). Just looking for some guidance lest I bleed cash pointlessly. Questions:

1. Any experience or speculation how useful (closeness of focus, sharpness, possibility of autofocus) such a rig might be?

2. For now, I am considering the Nikon 5T (-1.5 diopter) a/o 6T (-2.9). These appear to be good quality, and the TCE2 has a 62mm thread. Any comments on the quality of these lenses or alternatives?

3. If the answers to the above are encouraging, then it's time to think about a port. I am hoping that this won't be too expensive; it is just a flat port with enough standoff for the the coupler, lens, and diopter(s)...will this break my budget and heart?

Thanks!

Chris,

Doesn't Inon make a macro lens that will fit on the front of the CP-5000 housing? I haven't tried it but it might be a good (and less expensive alternative).

Doug

Doug,

That's a good suggestion. The Inon lens would be convenient.

I'm not sure how much the teleconverter set up would run me -- I already have the converter (for surface use), but would have to purchase the diopters and the port.

As you mentioned, the ported set-up would be much more limiting, but sure to draw manta rays whenever I had it in the water.

Also, the Inon supposedly works best at full wideangle on the camera's built in lens. That's opposite to the effect I want, namely to fill the frame without having to get any closer than 5-10 cm or so. Those ultrashort distances are not only difficult to get to on live critters, but I fear I risk injuring the animal (or damaging the gear).

For me, the main concern is minimum full frame image size (in centimeters).

The secondary concern is being able to lay off at least several inches and still fill the frame with a focused image of a very small item (the smaller the better).

I am looking at several sources, trying to sort it out. But the interaction of magnification (from the teleconverter and, I think, the Inon macros) and altered focal distance (from the diopters or the Inon macro) both affect the image size ... but not in a way I've been able to find out how to calculate. I'll keep looking, and post back if I figure out anything that might be worth sharing.

I recently purchased the Inon UCL-165 Macro Lens for use with my CP5000. I was frustrated that I couldn't get enough magnification on subjects less than 2 cm.

Anyway, I found the macro lens to be excellent and has filled the 'gap' for small macro subjects.

Here's a couple of images that were taken yesterday with the macro lens. It attachs easily underwater as it screws into the front of the Ike port. I generally carry it in my BC pocket until I find something small enough.

This cowrie Primovula species was about 1-2 cm.

This nudibranch Chromodoris roboi was only about 1 cm. Taken with Inon UCL-165 macro lens.

These cowries Primovula draperi were about 1.5 - 2 cm. Taken with Inon UCL-165 macro lens.

And finally, this image of a small blue ringed octopus was also taken with the Inon UCL-165 macro lens. The Blue ring was about the size of a 50 cent piece.

I'm now looking forward to shooting pygmies with it in Wakatobi.

Hello,

You can also stack two (or more, but watch out for vignetting depending on your camera lens / housing configuration) UCL-165M67 lenses together for greater magnification.

Details in UCL-167M67 User Manual:

INON UCL-165M67 User Manual

-Mark Rupert

Inon America

I also would like to get more "distance" for macro shooting with my cp5000. Any ideas to do this would be appreciated.

I also would like to get more "distance" for macro shooting with my cp5000. Any ideas to do this would be appreciated.

Exactly! I see the virtues of the (underwater changeable) Inon 165 (nice shots, Dave H! -- especially the little venomous octopus!). But: what was the object-to-lens distance in these shots? Some critters are hard to get close to without risk of spooking or worse.

For me, the rationale behind the TCE2 w/ diopters is to increase the standoff while maintaining a small image area -- sacrificing the flexibility of the Inon for other attributes. I don't know (but tentatively expect) that the Nikon T5 and T6 would work well with the CP5000 at full tele, because they are designed to work with a tele -- whereas the Inon is recommended for use at full WA (at least that what it says in their on-line PDF manual). Indeed, one must zoom well toward full tele to avoid vignetting with the TCE2/CP5000.

But I still don't know how to predict

--minimum focusing distance

--depth of field (at max f)

--minimum image area (clearly related to min focus dist, along with lens focal length)

and because I am still cogitating, I've not yet

--contacted Ikelite about cost of a "custom" port for the TCE2 w/ diopters.

However, I do already have the TCE2, and the Nik T5 and T6 are not too horrible a ripoff (by Nik standards) at $46 per on B&H.

Maybe I should post on the SLR forum to pull their expertise in on this problem?

Thanks.

By definition, a diopter brings your camera's infinity focus closer. A plus 1 diopter will bring the infinite focus to 1 meter.

I don't know what the diopter power of the Inon 165 is however. Perhaps it says on their website?

With that said, I used the Inon 165 with the Coolpix 5000 when I had it and I liked it a lot. It did let me get more magnification at decent working distances.

Cheers

James

By definition, a diopter brings your camera's infinity focus closer.  A plus 1 diopter will bring the infinite focus to 1 meter.

 

I don't know what the diopter power of the Inon 165 is however.  Perhaps it says on their website?

 

With that said, I used the Inon 165 with the Coolpix 5000 when I had it and I liked it a lot.  It did let me get more magnification at decent working distances.

 

Cheers

James

Yes, I am considering the Inon 165. Unfortunately, Inon is not explicit about the magnification or diopter of the 165 in their manual (that I could find), but perhaps the 165 implies a +6 diopter (165mm ~ 1m/6)?

Yet I am still intrigued by the potential potential of the combination of the CP5000, TCE2, and the Nikon T5/T6 diopters. Interestingly, the TCE2 *does* fit the diameter of the standard Ike flat port, and so it would "only" require a 8 or 12 cm extension to this port (don't have the T5 and T6, so don't know the final lens assembly length, or indeed if they fit the port also ... just did a "quick look" with the housing, camera, URE6, TCE2, and port).

The *possible* advantage of the Nik assemblage is the coupling of up to a 170mm (35mm equiv) lens (full zoom CP5000, 2X TCE2) with relatively close focusing (about 220 mm with the T5 (+1.5) and T6 (+2.9) stacked, total diopter ~ +4.4). Image quality? I dunno. But the TCE2 is fair (except for vignetting at less than near full zoom), and the T5/T6 are designed for tele -- whereas the Inon is designed for use with the camera lens near full WA.

I will look more at the Inon 165, and have inquiries in at Ikelite on a port extension... I will get back to y'all if I find anything interesting.

Thanks for the info.

Regards,

Chris

Chris,

Glad someone out there knew more than I did, when you hear back from Ike on the custom port please let us know the price and or if they'll do it. You might have started something new here. And oh yeh... nice shots Dave!

Don't need no stinkin SLR and 105 micro.

Doug

Okay, I just ordered a T5/T6 and will do some macro shots with them, with and without the TCE2. If anyone will loan me an Inon 165M67 for 3 wks (for surface use only) I will also take some shots with it for comparison. This little experiment will help me to learn and decide whether to pursue a custom port for this puppy with Ike.

I decided I wanted the T5/T6 w/ TCE2 for insect and reptile life here in bayou country, anyway. Below, hummingbird hawkmoth w/ TCE2, flash, 1/2000th, f2.9. Cropped. MUST GET CLOSER!

Quick update...

I have shot some RAWS with the TCE2 and the T5 & T6. Overall, the effect is not as great as I would have wished but I am still thinking about it.

A table of test shots is given below, indicating which converters were used, focusing mode, distance from the seam on the camera centerline, and the height of the exposed image in absolute units:

Use TCE2 Use T6 Use T5 Focus Distance, H, mm

mm

FALSE TRUE TRUE MIN 128 22

FALSE TRUE FALSE MIN 128 24

FALSE FALSE TRUE MIN 128 26

FALSE FALSE FALSE MIN 128 27

FALSE TRUE TRUE INF 287 61

FALSE TRUE FALSE INF 434 82

TRUE TRUE TRUE MIN 218 31

TRUE TRUE FALSE MIN 241 37

TRUE FALSE TRUE MIN 254 43

TRUE FALSE FALSE MIN 305 57

TRUE TRUE TRUE INF 348 35

TRUE TRUE FALSE INF 448 52

TRUE TRUE TRUE MAN 287 35

FALSE FALSE FALSE MAN 348 79

The important point: you can get an ~ 30 mm image heights (about an inch and aquarte) at distances as large as 218 mm (about 8 inches) with the exotic stack, but you need to be about 130 mm away (~5 inches) to get the same image height without the converters. This may help with some shy critters, but it's not the quantum leap I was looking for.

That said, the image from 287 mm with all the coverters looks very sharp (1:1 actual pixel image attached below). The tick marks in the image are 0.1 inches apart, and the NEF (RAW) image was processed using SharpRaw.

For me, if I can get a long port for my Ike housing cheap (the converters do fit in the standard port), it may be worth farting around with). Otherwise, on to the Inon 165 and a whole lot of bother avoided.