Sony 20mm, Tamron 17-28 or something else for Wrecks?

Hi all,

as the title said, I will save some money to invest in the future in new gear, which will be the new Sony A7 IV. I'm not satisfied with my current A6400 and I want to switch in the future and don't wast money on a case for a camera which I don't like in everything. 

So now the question, did anybody tested the Sony 20mm F1.8 or Tamron 17-28 for shooting wrecks? I think both should be very nice lenses but I lack the knowlege what focal lengths will suite me more. Both lenses have quite the same minimum focus distance, so its up the quality of the glass and zoom vs prime. 

Thanks for your help. 

1 hour ago, JYk said:

Hi all,

 

as the title said, I will save some money to invest in the future in new gear, which will be the new Sony A7 IV. I'm not satisfied with my current A6400 and I want to switch in the future and don't wast money on a case for a camera which I don't like in everything. 

So now the question, did anybody tested the Sony 20mm F1.8 or Tamron 17-28 for shooting wrecks? I think both should be very nice lenses but I lack the knowlege what focal lengths will suite me more. Both lenses have quite the same minimum focus distance, so its up the quality of the glass and zoom vs prime. 

Thanks for your help. 

I'm sure Phil Rudin will chime in, he's tested the Tamron 17-28 in UWP magazine issue 119 (free download).  The classic choice for wrecks is something in the 16-35 range, 20mm seems a little narrow for UW work and in general placing a lens in a dome tends to even things up a bit and any advantage a prime may hold on land tends to get muddied by the dome port optics. 

If you want to make the most of your sensor UW you could also look into the WWL plus 28-60 or the WACP also with 28-60 - depending on how deep your pockets are, they are generally judged to be clearly sharper than any zoom or prime in a dome with plenty of flexibility and in the case of the WWL setup easier to travel with.

7 minutes ago, ChrisRoss said:

If you want to make the most of your sensor UW you could also look into the WWL plus 28-60 or the WACP also with 28-60 - depending on how deep your pockets are, they are generally judged to be clearly sharper than any zoom or prime in a dome with plenty of flexibility and in the case of the WWL setup easier to travel with.

Thanks for your feedback. I was aware of WWL option, but I have the fear to get vendor locked by this setup. Isotta seems to me the prefered brand at the moment when it comes to case but this might change. I just want to be able to choose the brand without the fear, that the WWL might no work, because the ports are not compatible or I have to tinker myself a good solution.

1 hour ago, JYk said:

I was aware of WWL option, but I have the fear to get vendor locked by this setup. Isotta seems to me the prefered brand at the moment when it comes to case but this might change. I just want to be able to choose the brand without the fear, that the WWL might no work, because the ports are not compatible

WWL is the least vendor-lock option there is; it will go on any port that has 67mm threads that is the right length for the lens, which is basically any manufacturer and most camera/lens systems. WACP uses Nauticam's port mount, so you need a Nauticam housing or something with an adapter for the same, but WWL will go on almost anything.

The WACP comes with a nauticam  extension/adaptor (100 to 120 ??) saga do an set of alternate adaptors to match other housings - all costs vast amounts of money.

I use a sigma 15 fisheye for wrecks, and most other things. If I could work out how to link to photos I would put in a couple of examples, this might work

Justicia, Donegal

As Chris said above you can read my review for the Tamron 17-28mm F/2.8 in issue #119 at UWPMAG.com, this is a free PDF download. I also have reviewed for the WWL-1 and WWL-1B using M43 14-42, Sony 28mm F/2 and the Sony FE 28-60mm. The 28-60 is by far the best choice for Sony. The problem with this lens and the Tamron 17-28 is manufacture support. At this time Nauticam and Ikelite are the only manufactures that list the Tamron on the port charts and have dedicated Zoom gear. With the 28-60 Nauticam and Seafrogs are the only manufactures that support the 28-60 with a zoom gear and port with 67mm threads for the WWL-1/1B. The problem with Seafrogs is they only sell the port and gear with the Sony A7c housing at this time. The port and gear are not yet offered for all Sony housings. 

Regarding the Tamron 17-28 F/2.8 it is cheaper and has much better image quality overall than Sony FE 16-35mm F/4 or 12-24 F/4 which I have also used extensively along with 12-24mm F/2.8. I have also used the Sony FE 20mm F/1.8 and it is a great above water lens and equal to the Nikonos 15mm underwater. It would not be my first choice for wrecks.  

The Sony A7 IV is going to be a huge success for Sony and I am sure it will be supported by all of the major housing manufactures. The question remains will they add support for the lenses. I am sure that someone will point out that gears can be 3D printed for both lenses but proper ports are another issue.

8 hours ago, JYk said:

Thanks for your feedback. I was aware of WWL option, but I have the fear to get vendor locked by this setup. Isotta seems to me the prefered brand at the moment when it comes to case but this might change. I just want to be able to choose the brand without the fear, that the WWL might no work, because the ports are not compatible or I have to tinker myself a good solution.

First of all my normal suggestion is to work backwards from your subject to come up with the camera and case you need  to use that lens/port and realistically once you get a few ports in your collection you tend to be locked into that vendor.  Even then that is not the end of the world as there quite a few options with port adapters to take your ports with you to a new housing.

For example You can use Nauticam N120 ports on the large port port Isotta housings you just need to purchase a different lug ring to allow this: https://www.backscatter.com/Nauticam-Sea-and-Sea-3-Lug-Bayonet-Ring-Converts-N

This converts the Nauticam port to S&S and Isotta use the S&S bayonet for their ports and spacings are such that you use the Nauticam port chart.  I have heard that Isotta will make custom zoom rings for you - unfortunately you cant use Nauticam zoom rings.  The only issue is Nauticam use N100 ports for Sony, which won't work this way and you need to find an equivalent port in the N120 system.

Regarding the WWL - all that you have to get right to use the WWL is to choose the right length.  Nauticam list the N100 macro port 45 for the 28-60 and you can get an N120 macro port 45.    These ports are 45mm from the flange face to the inside of the port glass.  Isotta have a reasonable range of port lengths available and should be able to offer advice of which of their ports match a Nauticam 45mm port.

Thanks for your feedback, I will keep an eye on both options. Tamron 17-28 or Sony + WWL. There is still plenty of time to see what will be released but I think you're right that I should opt-in for a solid zoom and a good field-of-view. I think the brands will need some time to create a case for the new cameras so I can save some money. 

Phil, I'm curious about which use you think could be interesting with the sony 20mm. I was considering going for this lense to shoot CFWA on fish (20-45cm) over the 18-35 especially for its shorter min distance and higher magnification factor. 

So the Sony FE 20mm F/1.8 is an excellent above water lens and I have also tested it underwater in a pool. Regarding the use I would compare it to the Nikonos 15mm lens for 35mm film. This lens probably shot more U/W magazine covers than any lens since. The 94 or so degree AOV is quite nice for U/W use. Since the 15mm so many wider lenses like the Zeiss Batis 18mm F/2.8 and Sony 14mm F/1.8 both reviewed allowed U/W shooters to get closer and wider shots. Now wet lenses like WACP and WWL-1B provide even wider and smaller packages. 

Keep in mind that the 20mm still needs to be used with a large dome port. I have included examples with 180mm and 230mm at close range. The minimum focus range is excellent but once it is inside a port you are hitting the glass before you get to the closes focus, the duck with the 180mm port was bouncing off the port glass. Next I used a 30mm extension for both ports with a Nauticam housing. This was a guess on my part because Nauticam has not listed the 20mm on the ports charts even though it has been out for well over a year now.

I like the 20 and 24mm range for split images of people but this could just as easily be done with the Sony FE 12-24 or 16-35 and Tamron 17-28mm. All excellent zooms that are supported by Nauticam and some others.

Bottom line is that many of the modern zooms for mirrorless cameras are as good as a lot of prime lenses and the little bit of minimum focus distance you pickup is mostly offset by the size of the port you need for best corner sharpness. 

Last I don't know what 18-35 lens you are referring to unless you be be talking about something for APS-C sensors rather than full frame.

Duck is with 180mm port and 30mm extension and split is with 230mm port and 30mm extension on Nauticam housing.

Thanks Phil to do some testing for us. I think for it boils down to the Tamron 17-28 or the Sony 28-60 + Wetlens. Isotta allready has the Ports and Zoomgear for the Tamron, so this brand might also be a good solution. I wait for the prices of these brands. This hobby is just tooo expansive ...