Paralysed by indecision!

Hi all,

Help me make up my mind!

Its time to upgrade from a digicam, posting on here has convinced me to make the jump to dSLR - its a BIG jump.

I've handled the REBEL XT/350, D50 and D70. I'm put off Canon as it looks like they are the vanguard of FF sensors and will the crop sensor range exist in 12-18 months? Personally I dont think so, will Nikon stick with DX? Probably. The D50 felt too cheap and plasticky, D70s handled well I just didnt buy one at the time.

Until today I thought the new Olympus E-500 was the camera to go for, I like the dust filter technology, 8MP, the compact 4/3 body and lenses and the projected very competitive street price. OK so no housings at present but I bet Ike will be quick off the mark

Then wise words from James about lenses (thread in consumer/digicams)expensive 4/3 lenses as Olympus is effectively a monopoly supplier and total system costs have lead to another bout of indecision. In the UK a D70s twin lens kit & a Sigma 10-20mm zoom is ~£1240, the E500 plus 11-22 ZD zoom is ~£1180. I figure the rest of the kit (Ike housing and strobes) is pretty much a constant so have ignored it for the moment.

This camera is going to have to be the family workhorse as well as my underwater toy and the lenses are an investment so the body needs to be fully upgradeable i.e not constrained by different sensor crops.

SO after an overly long intro:

D70s or E500? Thoughts please

I am an Olympus fan and sure to be in the minority in this forum compaired to the Canon and Nikon owners. That being said I don't find all the lenses in the Olympus line to be over priced at all. Like every line, pro level lenses carry a pro level price. But Olympus has some very high quality glass within the same range or lower than the competition. By the time the E-500 housings arrive you will be able to get the following.

http://www.olympusamerica.com/e1/sys_lens_35mm.asp at about $220.00 US

http://www.olympusamerica.com/e1/sys_lens_8mm.asp $650 to 700.00 US

http://www.olympusamerica.com/e1/sys_lens_50mm20.asp, already out $450.00 US

The 35 mm is a F3.5 lens (70 mm in 35mm) which will focus to twice life size (in 35 mm)

The 8mm ( 16 FF fisheye in 35 mm) will focus to the dome and the 50 mm (100mm in 35mm) is a

F2 lens that will focus to life size in 35 mm.

Every camera co. has expensive glass but the lenses best suited to U/W photography are very competitive.

Phil Rudin

Hi Phil,

Thanks for chiming in from the Olympus camp. I was worried that we'd only hear from Nikon and Canon folks.

Personally, I'm putting away brand loyalty for this discussion and just sticking to comparing what's available to buy and how much it costs. I've owned cameras made by Kodak, Fuji, Nikon, and Canon, so I'm not much of a loyalist anyhow...:-)

Since Peter is comparing the D70s and the Oly, let me post some info about Nikon equivalent lenses:

Nikon 60mm Macro - focuses to 1.5:1 (35mm equivalent) on the D70 - <$350

Nikon 10.5mm Fisheye - $450

Nikon 105mm Macro - $450

In addition to the macro lenses above, for the D70 you can also get:

Sigma 150mm - $600

Nikkon 200mm - $1,000

These two are absolute bazookas but take incredible macro photos.

I think the key lens factor for underwater use is the cost of a good wideangle zoom. By all accounts the Sigma 10-20 is a good lens and even better is the low cost:

Sigma 10-20 - $500

or

Nikkor 12-24 - $900

Cheers

James

Peter may also want to consider that Olympus may well have an E-500 housing in the works. As with lenses you get what you pay for. I own the Olympus PT-E01 housing for the E-300. The housing cost is around $1000.00, (i have seen it as low as $919.00). The ports are optical glass and aluminum. They providing superb optics at a price higher than plastic domes but very competitive with the housings that are twice or three times the cost. All things being equal I am sure that an excellent system for the Nikon or the Olympus can be obtained at about the same cost.

P.S. Olympus has a 90/100 macro, 180/200 in 35mm in the works.

Phil

Phil,

Any thoughts on how the Oly E300 housing feels against Ikelites? I've been happy with my PT018 but the Ike housings are in a different league to it.

As usual camera stuff is miles cheaper in the States than over here and not it would seem entirely due to the exchange rate

Thanks

Each has upsides and down sides. The Ike ports cost less and mount much like the Oly PT-018. The E-300 housing has an aluminium ring attached to the front of the housing that the ports screw into. The ports are high quality glass and alum. costing more than the Ike ports. The Oly housing has an Oly TTL port which works in TTL with the FL-20 and FL 36 housings. To use my Inon Z-220 strobes in manual, I have a cord that goes from the Oly sync port to an Nikonos five pin type cord. With the Ike housing you can buy two types of ike's strobes and they will work in TTL. I prefer Inon over Ike and Ike over Oly land strobe housings. Like the Ike system it appears that future Oly PT-E housings will allow interchange of ports and other equipment.

For me it is about high quality lenses and ports. As long as Oly continues to release new housings along with new camera bodies as they have in the PT line, my ports will retain their value to me.

In regard to size the Oly housing for the E-300 is smaller than the Ike housing. Gears are included with the price of the dome and are very easy to install and remove. The rear has double o-ring seals and the view-finder is very good for a $1000.00 housing. They are both rated to the same depth and this housing is far above the PT line.

Phil

Phil,

It's nice to see something about the PT-E01 housing as there are almost no forum posts about it.

This housing looks very nice and I thought it was very well designed indeed. To my eye it makes the Ikelite ''one square box fits all'' approach look very crude indeed. Whilst the Olympus system is not as complete as the competition at least there is now a fisheye, wide angle zoom and two macro lens options. Here in the UK Olympus lens prices make equivalent Nikkors look quite cheap though.

The E300 has been around a while now and its difficult to tell if the E500 is its replacement or not. It will be interesting to see if Olympus continue along with another dSLR housing - lets hope so.

Interesting to see you've gone with what looks like an ultralite tray and handles. The Olympus strobe bulkhead is a pain though. How have you managed to get a Nikonos connector attatched and how are you using 2 strobes with one bulkhead?

If you've got time it would be nice to hear how you have found the housing to use?

Trev

Hi Trev,

Regarding the Oly TTl bulkhead, I obtained a cord from, http://www.mike-dive.de which is the oly to nik. I use a dual sync cord from Sea and Sea to connect my two Inon Z-220 strobes which fire in manual to the Nikonos end of the sync cord.

The housing has a plate on the bottom with five mounting holes which allow about any type of tray you might want to use. I tood the two handles off my ULCS, Nikonos RS flip tray and bolted them to the housing. Works well until I see somthing I like better. This is a new housing and accesories are slow in coming. No dome port or extension tubes in the US. yet.

Only four dives with the housing to date, two with the 50 macro and two today with the 11 to 22 mm behind a flat port. The macro in auto focus works very well all the way to life-size (35), suspect the F2 glass helps in this regard. The 11 to 22 worked well for things the size of a shark down to about 1:6 at the 22 end from about 22 cn. The gear for manual focus needs work. The teeth cover about 170 degrees around the gear. This works great on the zoom lenses but I would prefer that the macro gears covered at least 275 to 300 degrees around the gear to allow better control.

I have seen many posts on DPReview in Olympus DSLR fourm from Oly users in the UK that are buying lenses from US. by mail order. I don't understand the pricing problems but many have placed multiple orders to avoid UK pricing.

Anything else I can answer for you let me know.

Phil Rudin

I'll be that olympus housing is made by UK or Zillion. It looks like their work.

Very interesting, thanks for the photos Phil.

Cheers

James

Oly lenses do seem VERY expensive in the UK and VERY reasonable in the USA.

I wonder why?

Phil,

From your experience so far with this system are you impressed enough with it to continue and wait to get the dome port for the forthcoming 8mm or pehaps the 7-14 lens?

The new 35mm macro lens also looks interesting. Its physical dimensions indicate it might fit in the current PPO-E03 port. Does the even closer macro capability of this lens sound useful to you?

Your Nikonos flash bulkhead modification sounds an obvious change to make. Thanks for the post

Trev

Yes, I am very impressed with this housing vs. cost. I already own the 7 to 14 F4 which is an outstanding lens. The three items I need to complete my system are the PPO-E04 dome port and gear, the PER-E02 extension tube for the 7 to 14 behind the dome and the PER-E01 port extension for the macro port. This extension will allow the use of the 1.4 tele-converter which takes the 50 macro F2 to 1.4:1 (35mm) and makes the lens a 70mm F2.8 (140mm in 35). The new 35 f3.5 (70 mm in 35) already goes to twice life-size and works with the tele-converter making a 2.8:1 lens (98mm F4.5 in 35). I also own the Olympus extension tube which takes the 50 to twice life-size (in 35) and the 35 to 4:1 (in 35). I hope to see the dome and tubes in the next month or two.

http://www.olympusamerica.com/cpg_section/...duct=1140&fl=17

Phil

Here is some very disappointing news from Phil Askey at DPreview.com - who has just posted a preview of the E-500:

http://www.dpreview.com/articles/olympuse500/page3.asp

According to Phil:

"Looking through the viewfinder is unfortunately like looking down a tunnel, the actual focusing screen is very small. I found it difficult to check the focus distance (when focusing manually for instance) and also to even make out smaller detail, it's the smallest viewfinder I've seen on any recent digital SLR and is a bit of a disappointment."

The viewfinder is very important for a DSLR for underwater use, especially for macro >1:1 (frequently mentioned in this thread).

I've looked through the viewfinder on the Rebel XT and it is small - I can imagine it will be difficult to use underwater. If the finder on the E-500 is even harder to use than the XT that is a major negative for our segment.

Cheers

James

Agreed, that could effectively kill it for UW use.

I think I'll wait until I can get my hands on one in the shop for aplay but the D70s is looking stronger and stronger...............

Anyone have a comment on its viewfinder?

Peter S.

The consensus seems to be that the 20D has a slightly bigger/better viewfinder than the D70s. But that said, many fokls are making incredible images with the D70s. Just take a look around this site and you'll find great work.

Looking at the E500 samples, there seems to be a considerable amount of CA with the 14 mm lens. Whilst the specs sound nice, I'm not convinced this is best thing since sliced bread.