Phenom Manual White Balance

Hello everyone.

Here is my latest update on the Phenom and WB.

http://www.hdvunderwater.com/phenomwb.htm

Wags

Stunning results Paul!!

That is the blue we are talking about!!

Good job on finding a solution and testing it so rapidly.

Mike

Wow - looks like Shawn's hunch was right and Amphibico have an issue on their hands. What a difference!and not a small one either. I'm not in the FX1 league yet, but have just bought the little bro HVR-A1 and will make sure I end up with a manual WB in my housing-to-be. Thanks for the definitive testing Wagsy.

What a difference. That can make or break a shot. Nice job.

Joe

That makes up my mind for my little HC!.. now is it Ikelite or Gates????

jim

Thanks Wagsy

No worries, glad I could help. I'm just happy we nailed it and thanks to all the guys that gave me clues which pointed me in the right direction.

Still, the fact I had to modify a professional $10,000 AUS housing to make it work correctly leaves me wondering abit.

Quote" EWB by rumor, is somehow related to how the factory tests WB as part of the manufacture process. So it stands to reason that it may be different than actual results in the field with MWB."

It may be a problem all HDV cameras with EWB control will have. Time will tell.

Wags

Don't overlook Light & Motion housings. They were aware of the problems with electronic white balance early on, and did not put it on their production housings. The manual white balance on my Bluefin HD FX1, works perfectly.

Hi Videodan.

L & M indeed must of known something to change it.

I just got back from some more diving and the manual WB worked a treat down at an overcast 18 meters with the URPRO filter in.

Same again, I played around with EWB and MWB and MWB works heaps better so it is for sure a problem, there is no way they can deny it it now.

My second dive was in real green water inside the reef and I still managed to blue it up with MWB. I tried with EWB but no way could I achieve what I was getting using MWB.

Wags

Hi Wags, just an FYI- I know that Shawn was in communication with Amphibico last week on this, but he has disappeard from Instant Messenger for the last few days and I'm not sure when he'll resurface; he does travel a fair bit - however, he will definitely find your field data essential support. You can be sure he'll be very vocal about it once he's back online ....

Back online...an oh yes...I am on it! We are just lucky that Wags (aka McGuiver) was smart enough to figure out a definitive test.

McGuiver.. I loved that program..

Dive safe

DeanB

Yeh McGuiver I like that..

Shawn, make yourself the mod, it took me like 1 hour to make mine. It's rough and simple but works and cost me nothing as I made it up with bits I had laying around. Maybe go into full production as i'm sure every Phenom owner will want one.

Also try turning on your camera underwater and see if you get good colour. Don't use the EWB though. Seems when the camera boots up it takes a hit at the balance and it sometimes looks rather close to what you are after. Have your filter in.

I WILL NEVER USE THE EWB ON MY PHENOM AGAIN.

I was speaking to another u/w housing manufacturer today (who shall remain nameless - as he is by default an Amphibico competitor) and he was saying that in the 'industry' an electronic solution to the Sony WB challenge has been very elusive, and is thought not to be possible with the latest Sony bios. Apparently Amphibico had earlier been claiming that they had created a fix, but the rest were sceptical, especially as it seems that Amphibico's 'solution' actually accesses and resets the internal camera WB settings and is not merely 'assigning' the WB function. I'm only passing on heresay and cannot vouch for the accuracy or otherwise of these third party comments, but nevertheless I found it relevant as the observation was unsolicited ....

I recieved a call directly from Ron Hand (president of Amphibico). He stated they are taking this and other issues very seriously. I am sending my entire system in for testing. They will be looking closely and trying to resolve all the issues I have had with the housing. This will include white balance, dome sensitivity, flip arm locking, and uneven/moving vignetting. I really appreciate it when a company elevates customer needs to the top and immediate action is taken. I will be sure to let you know how things are resolved.

-shawn

Good to hear that Shaun, that is a step in the right direction

Thats good to hear shawn and lets us know what they come up with.

Mate the bottom line is since my dives with the mod I made, I am indeed getting better results with MWB method when shooting in normal ambient light just like I get with my normal mini DV 3CCD setup now.

There is for sure a difference using EWB and MWB. I'm just glad we picked it up before I started filming Whale Sharks and Mantas that will be here soon.

It seems to give everything a green feel to it with EWB. Most of the dives till now have been in greenish water and I thought not much of it. But when both camera's came out of the water from the same dive. The Mini 3CCD just gave a better blue colour to the water, although HDV was alot sharper. (I think Mike would say the same) That and what other HDV cameras were gettting in MWB housings got me thinking.

I'm sure they can make a mod like mine to offer everyone and we will all be happy

Paul

Just a thought.

Could the colour problems be fixed within editing. I have made some green tinged shots look a lot me natyral with Premier 6.5's colour correction filters. My next project involves freshwater fish in a lake that is often crap viz and very green. At the moment I've been using my TRV950, Dive buddy plus, no lights, Outdoor W/B setting and getting some really good, passable stuff. Its only 6M deep so it has good natural lighting.(when the suns out)

I was hoping my A1 would kick arse but with you guys bringing up the green water probs its getting me nervous. When I was at the Video show they were W/B throught the editing system in Avid. It looked phenomenal. Although it was topside shots, the bloke was W/B off of snow topped mountains on screen and adjusting with that. Also W/B off of peoples faces.

Hopefully this will address the Underwater W/B in the future so we will not have to worry so much

Dive safe

DeanB

Dean

You can fix up the WB in when editing, but that takes time and it will still not be as good as getting the correct colour when shooting. It will degrade your shot. Underwater material is alot harder than uptop due to all the particles.

The video cameras photo sensor plate is recording the light colours as it hits as is and then coverts every single pixel colour to a digital signal. Adding colour when editing does not really 100% correctly add to every single pixel so it won't look as good. It's the same with digital pics although RAWS are alot better to colour fix than Jpegs.

Another example, people say that when you edit HDV you can zoom in when editing without any noticable decline in quality when you output to normal DV or DVD because HDV is like 4+ times bigger than DV. Well you can indeed with uptop brightly light stuff but try that with underwater material and you can straight away see the quality drop.

The manual WB works a treat, its the EWB thats abit of a problem. Just get a housing with a manual White Balance button.

Cheers wags,

Like the PRO EVO when its avalible..

Only time will tell with technology. If we can W/B in editing then high cost cameras will be a thing of the past (maybe)

Cheers mate

Dive safe

DeanB

Hi All

A few people asked how I made my MWB modification.

Do this at your own risk and if you get better results, please let us all know...

http://www.hdvunderwater.com/phenommod.htm

Wags