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Lights, Strobes, and Lighting Technique / Archived topic

underpowered INON D180

Started by Alex_Mustard ·

  • 13Posts
  • 13Replies

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underpowered INON D180

13 posts
  1. I am having to borrow a friend's flashguns for my forthcoming trip to Sabah. Of course I am grateful that he has been able to help me out, but I am very disappointed with the performance of Inon D180. It is pathetic - it really isn't serious option for DSLR shooting.

     

    I have just been doing some tests to determine the relative strengths of the strobes for macro shooting. Testing them against the INON Z220 I have found out that

     

    D180 on full power (no diffusor) gives the same light at the Z220 on -4 power! For comparison this is equivalent to between 1/8th and 1/16th power on my Subtronic Alpha. And even the tiny YS30 Sea and Sea strobe is equivalent to the Z220 on -2 Power. And of course I am going to have to add both filters and diffusors to the Inons to get the light anything like where I want it.

     

    Damn those unreliable Subtronics. :)

     

    Alex

    Edited by Alex_Mustard
  2. Hi Alex,

     

    This is no surprise really, as the D-180 is made for use with compact digicams. I can see how it's a disappointment if you're expecting to use it on an impending trip though :-(

     

    FWIW, I was quite pleased with 2x Z220's for macro shooting at ISO200.

     

    Cheers

    James

  3. Something here is amiss... I'm guessing the ACC "OFF" magnet is not installed in the back of the strobe, and if it is, the internal reed switch is malfunctioning.

     

    The d180 isn't a flamethrower, but should be about equivalent to the Z-220 on -1 or so...

  4. Alex,

     

    I think something went wrong. The difference between Z220 and D180 in terms of brightness is around 1/2 f-stop from the specs (GN22 vs. GN18). Maybe some more or less depending on distance you are shooting (GN is never the same underwater along different distances) or spec data roundings or whatever. But -4 would mean the D180 throws out ~ 6% the brightness of the Z220. No way :)

     

    I am sure you haven't set the D180 to auto mode where the strobes judges how much light to fire in accordance with its built in auto sensor.

     

    To me this sounds like the D180 tries to mimic the digital camera's preflash which isn't used for measuring as the D180 is an auto strobe. But if this is actually the main flash (no preflash) it won't work. That is my guess and as Ryan said, has to be configured (magnet as far as I remember).

     

    Julian

    Edited by Jolly
  5. Thanks for the tips guys! Really appreciated.

     

    Anyway I have given up on the Inons and instead am using a pair of YS90s from Sea and Sea. All I want is a strobe that does what I tell it too!

     

    What was interesting on the D180 is that as I tried everything to increase the power and could only make it weaker!

     

    Alex

  6. The YS90 is weaker than the Z220, and only 1/3 stop more powerful than a properly functioning D180. I've used Z220 and YS90 strobes together in the past with good results-

    Edited by Ryan
  7. I had the same problem with the D2000w... until I read the manual and inserted the magnet in :)

     

    This follows a long tradition for me of trying out something, then reading the manual if I can't get it to work after a reasonable amount of time :angry::wub::wub:

  8. Hi Alex

     

    just to confirm with the others really, i tested my new Z-240's, as you will know it has the Magnet switch built into the strobe and you simply push it in to switch it to pure manual. if i dont push this magnet switch in, it only outputs a small amount of light which no matter what i do to change it it simply will not alter its power.

     

    So I presume that with the magnet out, it thinks it has an a optical connection or a digicam attached..

     

    Otherwise at full wack i've loads of power.

     

    I completely understand where your coming from regarding "I just want a strobe that does what I tell it too do"

     

    regards

     

    craig

  9. I accept it is my fault for not reading the manual. But they were borrowed strobes so I didn't have a manual. I also don't have the magnet!

     

    As a wider issue, I am not a idiot when it comes to camera kit and the fact that experienced photographers like Matt , Craig and I can't figure out how to get these strobes working without reading the manual I think highlights the overly complex design of the Inon range. Good design should be ergonomic and intuative to use.

     

    I think that the Z220 is pretty intuative, but the D180 and D2000 are less so - and particularly their power controls are very confusing (if like me you just pick them up and don't read the manual). Over the years I have shot with many brands of strobes (Inons, Sea and Sea, Nikon, Morris, Subtronic) and with the exception of Inon have found all intuative.

     

    Perhaps the only thing more confusing than the multiple modes on these strobes is trying to figure out their ever changing Inon range. :) Only joking, before I get a hard time from Inon dealers!

     

    Alex

    Edited by Alex_Mustard
  10. No Alex to be honest.

     

    It took me about 30 seconds to completely get to grips with the Z-240.

     

    i only got a japanese manual so, i cant say anymore really

     

    the main function on the 240 are all with the magnet pushed in

     

    TTL (when available) AUTO (external) Manual FULL Manual -.5 to -6 EV

     

    it was really simple and they work exceptionally well.

     

    i think all other functions with this magnet apply to using optical cords

     

    regards

     

    craig

     

    p.s I never read the Manual first. always to play and learn is better, then if i dont succeed then I open the book. but when i cant sleep its always nice to have a cure for my insomnia ...

    Edited by craig nelson
  11. Hi Alex,

     

    I totally agree with you. As far as I remember even the D180 manual doesn’t have a straight forward description like “for cameras without preflash insert the magnet into the holeâ€. You’ll rather find charts of camera types classified into categories like “P-TTLâ€, “R-TTLâ€, “R-Sâ€, etc. and according magnet switch settings. Without the manual it gets a kind of guessing game. That occurs frequently over here as Inon ships strobes with Japanese manuals only.

     

    it was really simple and they work exceptionally well.

     

    i think all other functions with this magnet apply to using optical cords

     

    Alex’ borrowed D180 can be triggered optically only. So it isn’t as easy as just plugging in the sync cord and using it right out of the box because the preflash mode has to be configured for different kind of cameras and/or slave operation. D180 was designed for compact digital cameras, so default setting is for cameras with preflash ("advanced cancel circuit") which requires reconfiguring for slave operation monitoring a non-preflash main strobe.

     

    Julian

  12. Thanks Julian

     

    my knowledge and the ability to aquire knowledge on inon products is well you could say

     

    TRASH..

     

    I've tryed to get PDF versions of their manuals but for some reason they dont seem to like to add them to a downloads section on their site.

     

    I'm sure this is not a problem and can aid in the sales process from time to time.

     

    thanks for the information though, learning has taken place.

     

    craig

  13. we were having a discussion similar to this on digitaldiver a couple of weeks ago:

     

    http://www.digitaldiver.net/yabbse/index.p...;threadid=18167

     

    the following is one of my posts to that thread, discussing an Inon D 180 along with a Fuji E 900:

     

    Advanced Cancel Circuitry (ACC) was designed to increase camera battery life and to speed up the camera's flash recycle time.

     

    The default setting on your strobe has ACC activated. In other words you do not have to take any actions to activate the system. You only have to take an action, in this case installing a magnet, to deactivate the system. The system was designed for cameras that emit a preflash. A preflash aids the camera in determining exposure. Your camera, the Fuji E 900, emits a single preflash and therefore has the ability to take advantage of Advanced Cancel Circuitry. If however your camera did not emit a preflash, such as the Fuji 810, you must shut off the ACC. To shut off ACC, you must install the magnet into the strobe.

     

    As you read this explanation of ACC, keep in mind that the camera's onboard flash is blocked from influencing the actual composition. The E 900 onboard flash's responsibility is only in sending optical signals to fire to the external Inon strobe.

     

    ACC "magnifies" the preflash.

     

    When ACC is activated, the Inon strobe "replaces" the relatively "less intense preflash pulse" with an artificially "magnified blast" of preflash light of its own. The camera sensor detects the "magnified blast" and calculates the exposure with that information. The camera is fooled into thinking that there is much more light present in the composition. Since the camera now feels there's a significant amount of light present due to the feedback it received from its sensor, it commands its own onboard flash to emit a much smaller amount of strobe energy for the main shutter event.

     

    Less onboard flash energy emitted, less camera battery energy used. Shorter onboard flash duration, quicker recycle time for camera's flash to recharge equals quicker turnaround time for next image capture.

     

    When you set the strobe to S-TTL, the Advanced Cancel Circuitry is automatically deactivated.

     

    references:

     

    http://www.inonamerica.com/content/docs/Ad...ircuit2F375.pdf

     

    http://www.digitaldiver.net/lib_docs/D180Manual_1.10.pdf

     

    hth,

    b

     

    and also:

     

    Q. When is ACC beneficial?

    A. Two Strobe Output Control Modes can benefit from ACC. External Auto and Manual.

     

    In both strobe output control modes mentioned above, the camera is not responsible for the strobe exposure calculations. In manual mode, the user decides how much light the strobe will influence the composition. In External Auto, the user matches the aperture value of the strobe with that of the lens. In external auto, the user may also make minor user defined adjustments to control the strobe's output.

     

    Since the user is responsible for ultimate control of the strobe's output in both control modes above, the role of the camera's preflash is somewhat circumvented.

     

    Originally the preflash was created to aid the camera in determining exposure. By sending out a known quantity of light during the preflash event, the camera's brain could then determine how much strobe light to emit for the main event by analyzing the amount of reflected light it received by its sensor originating from the preflash.

     

    But again, since External Auto and Manual strobe control modes do not require the camera to make that decision, the preflash function is somewhat negated.

     

    With the implementation of ACC, Inon techs found a way to take advantage of the preflash system. At least manipulate it. First remember that the onboard flash is blocked from actually influencing the composition. iow, it really doesn't matter how bright or dim the actual light is emanating from the onboard flash as long as the sensor of the Inon strobe can detect it for firing signals.

     

    What tends to happen in a typical scenario with a preflash camera underwater is that the tiny onboard flash emits a preflash originally intended to pass through air and not water. Relatively speaking, a very small amount of that preflash light makes its way back to the camera sensor for calculating the amount of strobe power needed for the actual image capture. Because of this, the camera then commands its onboard flash to emit a full dump of light. This taxes both the camera's battery and the amount of time it takes the flash to recharge. The result is a waste of time and energy.

     

    Inon techs designed their strobe's circuitry to emit a much more powerful blast of light once it receives the preflash trigger. Because the camera now sees a relatively powerful blast of light being reflected back to its sensor, it in turn directs its onboard flash now to emit a much smaller burst of light during the actual shutter event, once again, saving battery energy and time in onboard flash recycling.

     

    S-TTL:

     

    When the strobe is set to S-TTL, ACC is automatically deactivated. Doesn't matter if the magnet is in or out.

     

     

    hth,

    b

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