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2 New Nikon DSLR Rumours

Started by Alex_Mustard ·

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2 New Nikon DSLR Rumours

32 posts
  1. The crazy world at DPReview is full of seemingly reliable rumours of new Nikons DSLRs, that will be announced in 30 days and on sale in the "fall".

     

    The source of these rumours is DPReview member Jeff-C - who has a long history of correctly predicting forthcoming Nikon DSLRs and he clearly has strong insider links with Nikon.

     

    http://forums.dpreview.com/forums/read.asp...essage=24110549

     

    The rumours are of two cameras. A pro body - D2X and or D2H replacement. And probably of more interest to underwater photographers a D200 replacement. Tantilisingly for underwater photographers the source speculates that:

     

    There is another possibility of using an old D200 image: the new D200 replacement is exactly a D200 externally, just some of the internal parts are replaced, like the D40X to the D40 as someone speculated: different sensor, tweaked AF module, and improved image processing engine.

    The D200X, for the lack of better name now, does surprised me as it's not up to refresh by Nikon's normal schedule. However, a rumored Canon 40D and a Sony A-10 are coming, a quick "facelift" to the D200 may be one the tricks from Nikon to keep its product portfolio competitive

     

    Which means it might fit in existing D200/S5 housings.

     

    Anyway, these speculation posts come up all the time. But this one does come from a source with an excellent track record.

     

    Alex

    Edited by Alex_Mustard
  2. Er - has any of these updated bodies ever fitted seamlessly into a housing ?

     

    Maybe D70 / D70s, so I may have answered myself.......

  3. And D40/D40X.

  4. And D2H , D2X & D2X's.

     

    Here's hoping we can keep this pattern up. :):);)

  5. And don't forget F90/F90x, and F801/F801s.

     

    Fingers crossed for D200 owners.

     

    Personally I think we should write to the camera manufacturers. Not asking for them to keep their camera bodies the same for our benefit. As if they care about underwater photographers. But instead explaining that by keeping camera bodies the same they will save lots of money and that they can use underwater photographers as an excuse!

     

    Alex

    Edited by Alex_Mustard
  6. And don't forget F90/F90x, and F801/F801s.

     

    I had to look them up with Google !

     

    Seems I may not be old ( OK - substitute 'experienced' - for those of a sensitive nature ) enough to remember them....

     

    Paul C

  7. Also known as the Nikon N8008, 8008s, N90, N90s in the U.S. market. I had the N8008/8008s in a Tussy housing for years. Great macro setup with a 105 mm.

     

    Phil Rudin

    post-2618-1185371551_thumb.jpg

    post-2618-1185371565_thumb.jpg

  8. Well... I heard from my usual source to certainly start saving money. The official announcement is probably 30-60 days away at least and whatever new model it is, won't be available until end of the year or possibly early next year so Merry Chrismas or slightly late merry chrismas to some lucky people! Unconfirmed but it may be a good news for owner of D2X housing. Also expect some new nifty toys to accompany the new camera.

  9. I'm starting to believe the rumours ... a local camera store is selling the D2Xs for $5595 AUD and its $4200 AUD from HK ... the RRP here is $6800

  10. Unconfirmed but it may be a good news for owner of D2X housing.

     

    My concern would be the prism size with some housings. Made tricker still if an optional action finder is offered.

     

    Alex

  11. That's true. All I was told was that from a brief glance, it look identical to D2X but can't tell if it is the exact same body or not. Viewfinder however should definitely be bigger. hmmm.. may be just a new back for the housing?

  12. According to Thon Hogan, Nikon announcement shouldn’t be far away…

    And a lot of new lenses too…

     

    Check this:

    http://bythom.com/2007comments.htm

     

     

     

    Best regards,

    Marcelo Krause

  13. According to Thon Hogan, Nikon announcement shouldn’t be far away…

    And a lot of new lenses too…

     

    Check this:

    http://bythom.com/2007comments.htm

    Best regards,

    Marcelo Krause

     

    Better be good given Canon's announcement today, the bar just got higher!

  14. It looks like Thom Hogan is back from his yearly vacation. He posted some of his musings about the upcoming Nikon announcement:

     

    "Curiously, what we're about to get appears to be what photographers (other than me) asked for: ISO improvements. By taking the pro body to a full frame, improving the sensor technology, and not pushing the pixels too far upwards, high ISO noise should be relatively well controlled. Indeed, if rumors are correct, Nikon will be allowing you to go to ISOs you didn't know existed (couple that with some of the classic fast Nikkors and, well, so much for carrying the SB-800 with you). Personally, I'll be looking closely at the base ISO results, as that's what will drive my use of the camera. Likewise, the new autofocus system will get a lot of my attention, as it marks a dramatic change for Nikon."

     

    He thinks they will be announced at the Osaka Games starting Aug 26th.

     

    He also doesn't think it will be the pro body replacement but more like a D200 type camera - since Nikon was so successful w/ that one. Thom's aware of the Canon announcements this week and says that the Nikon announcement won't be comparable to the Canon announcement and people should not compare Nikon Dwhatever to the Canon 1DsIII

     

    "Unfortunately, if I'm right about which prototype is being introduced this week, the Canon/Nikon pro user debates will continue unfettered. That's because Canon will up the 1DsII from 16mp to 21mp this week, and Nikon will be once again stuck facing the "fewer pixels" complaint from some users (because they're comparing the wrong camera with the wrong camera). But if you go back and read my roadmap, the high resolution follow up camera from Nikon isn't expected until the middle of next year (and the about-to-be-announced high-speed pro camera is following at about the predicted interval, especially if it doesn't ship until later this fall). Thus, the fireworks are probably not over yet--Nikon appears to be about six months behind Canon in announcing new pro cameras this time, but appears also to be clearly matching or exceeding them this time around (again, making some assumptions about image quality). I can wait six months."

     

    Link here:

     

    http://www.bythom.com/2007comments.htm

     

    Cheers

    James

  15. James, I think that the general consensus amongst Nikon folk including TH is that Nikon will announce 2 cameras - a FF D2H replacement and a APS-C D200 replacement.

     

    I think both will have very good High ISO performance, although that is of limited use UW. Both should also have high frame rates. I personally suspect that the D200 replacement might have Sony's new CMOS APS-C sensor.

     

    A D2X replacement is expected to appear next year, in a similar way to Canon doing the 1D before the 1DS.

     

    Of course this all remains speculation. But there is a good chance that one or both might fit in existing housings.

     

    Alex

  16. The Sony sensor has a 5.5 micron pitch and 12 bit ADC. Not sure how good the high ISO performance will be with that though it could be better than the existing D200. It sure does seem likely that the Sony sensor will be used considering the timing and the persistent rumors that the D200 successor will be bumped to D2x res.

     

    What will be interesting is the frame rates of such a D300. TH says that the AF system will be shared between the D3h and D300 and the Sony sensor is capable of 10+ fps. It would be quite surprising to see such high frame rates in a body priced similar to the D200 (though that's a big assumption at this point).

     

    It may be a bit disappointing that only the D3h version is announced and not the D3x. It's good to see the 1Ds3 but the specs for that camera are not at all surprising. If Nikon does go full frame with the D3h, it will be interesting to see how it compares to the 1D3 and how much resolution the D3x version offers when it is introduced later on. I hope Nikon goes 14 bit with these sensors; staying 12 bit is OK with DX as far as I'm concerned. The 40D has 14 bit now but I'll be surprised to see that it helps that sensor in any way. If Canon can exceed 12 stops at base ISO with a 10MP 1.6 sensor then they've made impressive progress.

     

    I think the 14-24 f/2.8 lens rumor is intriguing. I've felt for a while that 13-14 on the wide end is enough and that I'd rather have that with f/2.8 than the existing 12-24. Sadly, I'd hoped for a 14-28 or longer on the long end, especially if it's not a DX lens. I've never been a fan of the 12-24. At least Nikon will finally add VR to their long primes.

  17. The 40D has 14 bit now but I'll be surprised to see that it helps that sensor in any way. If Canon can exceed 12 stops at base ISO with a 10MP 1.6 sensor then they've made impressive progress.

     

    The area of the 1.6x sensor is about 2/3 the area of the 1.3x sensor, so the signal-to-noise of the 40D should be within one stop of the 1DIII at the same exposure and ISO. Even if by the usual definition of dynamic range, max signal/noise level, the sensor is not quite 12 bits, there is still information below the RMS noise level and the extra resolution will still help. It'll make the parts below noise level fuzzy instead of banded.

     

    Looking at it another way, with a 14-bit A/D the parts of a shot that are 2 stops under exposed will have the same sensor output as the same sensor with a 12-bit A/D set to 2 stops higher ISO. Assume the same sensor, the output of an ISO 100 shot with the 14-bit A/D will be no worst than an ISO 400 shot with 12-bit A/D. If nothing else, it will give you room for underexposure in cases where you want to really be sure to preserve the highlights.

     

    I'm not surprised that Canon put the 14-bit A/D in the 40D. It probably cost them less to make just one Digic III and associate IO that process 14-bit and use it for all the camera than to make 2 versions. The only incremental cost is a little more memory for the same shot buffer.

  18. The area of the 1.6x sensor is about 2/3 the area of the 1.3x sensor, so the signal-to-noise of the 40D should be within one stop of the 1DIII at the same exposure and ISO. Even if by the usual definition of dynamic range, max signal/noise level, the sensor is not quite 12 bits, there is still information below the RMS noise level and the extra resolution will still help. It'll make the parts below noise level fuzzy instead of banded.

    I'm not sure what the raw, base ISO capability if the 1D3 sensor is, so assuming 1 stop less doesn't tell me what the 40D sensor will be. We know that the D200 sensor can achieve 12 bits and not any more, the 40D is a newer design but has to make do with a slightly smaller pixel. If Clark is to be believed, the D200 has at least of a stop of improvement available, so I could see the 40D sensor offering 13 stops. I think that would be remarkable though.

     

    Looking at it another way, with a 14-bit A/D the parts of a shot that are 2 stops under exposed will have the same sensor output as the same sensor with a 12-bit A/D set to 2 stops higher ISO. Assume the same sensor, the output of an ISO 100 shot with the 14-bit A/D will be no worst than an ISO 400 shot with 12-bit A/D. If nothing else, it will give you room for underexposure in cases where you want to really be sure to preserve the highlights.

    If what you are saying is that 14-bit gives you a 2 stop improvement in ISO performance, as would be suggested by your explanation, then absolutely not. If that were the case, all we'd need for great high ISO would be 20 bit converters!

     

    The output of the sensor, after amplification, is referenced to a set voltage which is the maximum voltage the ADC responds to. This is independent of the number of bits in the converter. The "extra" bits added in the 14 bit converter, therefore, aren't at the "top", they're at the "bottom". The analog voltage representing 2 stops below maximum will be 1/4 of maximum voltage regardless of bit depth or ISO. If a sensor has less than 12 stops of range, then both the 12 and 14 bit converters will be digitizing noise in their lowest bits.

     

    Assuming the same sensor with substantially less than 12 stops of dynamic range, both the 12 bit and 14 bit converters are capable of delivering the full range of the sensor and the 14 bit converter does not offer better performance at ANY ISO. There may be qualitative differences in noise in cases where the sensor performance is very near 12 stops as is the case with most DSLR sensors today. 14 bit converters may offer potential advantages at lower ISOs in that case. I would like to see a demonstration of that, however.

     

    I don't doubt that the 40D could benefit from better converters or that it is capable of slightly better than 12 stops, but I would just be surprised if the benefit is substantial. The proof will be in the testing, and that proof will probably NOT come from dpreview.

     

    It should also be noted that 14 bit converters are harder to make and can also be noisier than 12 bit ones. I have no doubt that Canon has a handle on that, but it makes the situation murkier still as a 14 bit converter *could* result in worse performance theoretically.

     

    I'm not surprised that Canon put the 14-bit A/D in the 40D. It probably cost them less to make just one Digic III and associate IO that process 14-bit and use it for all the camera than to make 2 versions. The only incremental cost is a little more memory for the same shot buffer.

    I think that's right and, furthermore, Canon gets mileage out of the branding of 14 bit. Just as Canon has convinced people that they are better because of the "Digic" branding (much like the "L" branding), Canon will take marketing advantage of their 14 bit converters whether they offer performance benefits at 1.6x crops or not.

  19. Interesting rumors, I've been out for so long! A new D300 (or whatever it is called) with D2x focus capabilities would really tempt me...

Isotta

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