Angry as can be...!

Hi all. Haven't been around for awhile - life interferes. Sigh.

Anyway, last week we were in Yap. As wonderful as it was, the diving was marred, as a particular diver displayed what I (or my cat, for that matter) would consider sub-par skills underwater. They pretty much had no buoyancy skills, let alone trim; and often engaged in what I certainly wouldn't consider marine-life friendly actions.

After watching him literally chase away the mantas, I resolved to stay away from this person. My experience has been that attempting to correct such divers is futile; any helpful comment, no matter how diplomatic, is usually met with hostility and defensiveness. So I just stay away.

At the end of the trip, one of our group witnessed this diver on the nightly Mandarin Fish dive. This photo was shot by Mike Heit, on 06 March 2010, at dusk:

The environment here is finger coral, which is also the Mandarin's home. This diver was fins in the coral, knees on the coral, and (later) laying on the coral. The coral was used as a nice compressable bean bag support for his video housing as you can see above. Pretty much, it was a swath of broken coral everywhere he went for an hour.

I do not know the name of this diver; he was part of a group from Belgium, and dove with a large Amphibico housing. This housing seemed to give him a sense of entitlement, as I witnessed him use it to push a shooter away from a subject they wre working, and "take over".

I should point out that others in this group from Belgium were nice folks, very courteous, and with great skillz - you'll notice the diver behind him has no issues with trim or buoyancy!

I'm posting this partly as a rant, and, in the hopes that some presssure from the internet may trickle through to them. Maybe, it will make them re-think their lack of skills and consideration for the environment.

All the best, James

PS - well, at least I feel better for getting it off my chest!

god I hate it when people do that. especially at the mandarin site! disrespectful and unacceptable. I used to pick people off the coral when they did that and give them an earful, i would also film them doing it so they can't say "no I didn't". Unfortunately, some of the guides are a bit shy and won't do so while others will.

If those witnessing take no action, there is no one else left.

So rather than allow an hour of coral crashing, what would be the correct action right at that time..not waiting until surfacing after the coral is trashed?

What is the correct action?

No action does not seem to be the answer.

Hey, isn't he the guy named JON who is tagging the corals at the manta dive in Raja?

Its a freaking crime ... I've seen very similar things when diving and its shocking. Buoyancy is one of the first things to get right. Idiots.

My advice would be to turn their air off or if they have one turn on their emergency buoyancy cylinder

Dive safe

DeanB

Absolutely disgusting behaviour but not uncommon

A couple of years ago I witnessed an experienced diver at a protected marine park (Moses Rock in Eilat Israel) who having found a small frogfish in a wall stood on a table coral to get the shot.

I grabbed him by the shoulder and tried to stop him, he pushed me away quite forcefully, I tried again and was given a two finger response followed by another violent shove.

I took these images and gave them to the Marine Rangers at Moses Rock who with Glock 9mm's on their hips sat at the dive centre waiting for everyone to kit up in hope of recognising his wetsuit and kit.

The guy was nowhere to be seen.

The following morning I found the Table Coral laying broken in the sand

What digusts me the most was that this was a concious act, he knew exactly what he was doing, and violently resisted any attempts to stop him.

And the fact that this was during the Epson Red Sea Shoot-Out means he is likely to consider himself as a serious shooter.

Maybe evan a member of this forum !!!

I consider him to be a serious Wan*er

Lets set up a system to burn these idiots at the stake !!!

Nige Wade

Sometimes you wish you had a speargun handy

If those witnessing take no action, there is no one else left.

So rather than allow an hour of coral crashing, what would be the correct action right at that time..not waiting until surfacing after the coral is trashed?

 

What is the correct action?

No action does not seem to be the answer.

Sneak up behind them fill their BC and then turn their air off

Stew

I was thinking perhaps ripping off their mask and swimming off with it might get their attention. If they are diving in your boat, the ride back might get interesting.

Very sad to see!!! and leave me feeling angry without even being there.

I think its a good idea, if the diver(s) is aware of what they are going and don't want to be corrected, to take photos of the offender and make it know to him that their photo are being taken.

If there are officials around present it to them. If possible try to get a few photos from different angles.

Sadly I also think if the issue is not addressed then and there, nothing will come from it.

That's why you always carry a dive knife......good for cutting an airhose! That should get rid of the offender pretty quick!

Bob

This is indeed a conundrum. How DO you rectify such behavior?

As satisfying as direct action may be, changing someone's buoyancy or turning off gas can lead to dire consequences, and could easily be interpreted as assault. This is not a realistic option IMHO.

To be honest, in the past I've pointed out such transgressions (while still underwater) only a couple times. Twice I got the one-finger salute, and once the cold shoulder. So this doesn't work.

Bringing up the topic at the surface, or back at the resort rinse tank, usually fares no better. It doesn't matter if you are nice as can be and use an approach worthy of a politician negotiating a nuclear cease-fire. Indeed, this only seems like an opportunity to add verbal abuse from the transgressor to your woes. My experience is that:

*The transgressor knows they are doing bad things to the reef, but does it anyway, and covers for this with hostility and aggression towards the person that exposes this publicly

*The transgressor isn't really aware that they are doing bad things, but becomes hostile towards someone telling them (in essence) that their diving skills suck

*The transgressor becomes incensed if someone reports them to the dive operation management, and transfers their anger to the person that ratted them out

*Not once have I seen a transgressor say "oh, quite right, stupid of me, I'll fix it! Sorry".

So what to do?

In this case, I saw this diver's behavior earlier in the week; no good would come of a confrontation, so I avoided this diver, and paid attention to the diver I could control the behavior of - me - and made sure I was as picture-perfect as a UTD training video. The photo was shot on the last night we were there, and the last night for the transgressor diver too; so no good would have come of complaining the next day.

Hence, I chose this method. Post the picture in a place where everyone will jump on and condemn the behavior; perhaps this will make the diver in question re-think their ways, and affect a permanent change.

Heck if anyone has a realistic idea of how to confront someone about this that really works, I'm all ears.

All the best, James Flenner

You need to name and shame them. Put a face picture on the web with their name and reef wrecker against it. i wish i had done this years ago to a woman called Issabel Heffner who I witnessed trashing the reef on Bunaken all in the name of getting a photo.

http://outdoors.webshots.com/photo/1543694846072176087tuJiZR

Stew

Stew,

I love how you have an album called Coral Wrecking - right no my friend!

I had a look at the closeup photo and while it does look like she is kneeling on the substrate, it doesn't look like her knees or fin-tips are touching any coral. If you posted that photo of me and called me a coral wrecker I would be very pissed off.

Cheers

James

Stew,

 

I love how you have an album called Coral Wrecking - right no my friend!

 

I had a look at the closeup photo and while it does look like she is kneeling on the substrate, it doesn't look like her knees or fin-tips are touching any coral. If you posted that photo of me and called me a coral wrecker I would be very pissed off.

 

Cheers

James

its the fin on her right foot that was doing all the damage, actually both of them were knocking clumps of coral off. she actually had her regulator ripped out of her mouth on a different dive by another diver. sadly i missed this.

Stew

she actually had her regulator ripped out of her mouth on a different dive by another diver. sadly i missed this.

 

Stew

Dangerous but

Dive safe

DeanB

Dive masters/schools should play a big role in this, especially if they are diving in a marine reserve. In particular they should be very explicit that this kind of behavior will not be tolerated prior to the start of diving. You are much more likely to prevent this from happening than to correct behavior after the fact when people get all defensive or worse.

If you still end up with a bottom trawler or unmitigated ahole in your group and the dive master turns a blind eye, I would hope to find the courage to make both aware of the damage done. If they don't alter their behavior it doesn't mean it won't affect them over the long haul, at least they can't pretend that they weren't aware of it. In addition, I wouldn't feel comfortable posting a picture of the event on-line if I hadn't spoken my mind when it happened.

That said, taking a picture, especially a recognizable one, and posting it on-line is a good idea. I would also mention the dive operation I was with when it happened, which may end up having a bigger effect than shaming the one diver who to most will remain anonymous. Actually, I probably wouldn't make it a shaming post. Just state what happened as objectively as possible and let readers vote with their fins. I also would reserve this for offenders who clearly know what they are doing and just don't give a crap, not an accidental brush against the reef.

Bart

So what to do?

Well, one possibility would be to email the dive centre whose client this guy was, with a jpeg and tell them that this behaviour is unacceptable and ask them how they will stop it in future. You could tell them that their response will be posted here on wetpixel (explaining that a huge number of underwater photographers view wetpixel) and that should their response be negative (or if they don't respond) or should more examples like this come to light then this may well result in potential adverse publicity. This is the only way I can think of which might make a difference. Of course Eric may have to consider the implications and sanction such action?

Belgian? Amphibico Phenom? Home made bottom tray with open tubes and t-piece to use as a tripod? Top side EX1? Aged around 50......?

I think he's here now.......

Paul, the dive centre had a very good reaction to this. Fdog and I have been communicating about it via PM.

There was a staff meeting with all dive staff 2 hours after the dive centre read the original post...

As someone who used to work there, believe me, that sort of behaviour is not tolerated by management and management does take action when it is reported. But, as James said, he didn't want to have it turn into a public confrontation which is his decision and has to be respected.