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Lights, Strobes, and Lighting Technique / Archived topic

Lightweight Wide-angle Strobe Alternatives

Started by Pfuller ·

  • 25Posts
  • 25Replies

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Lightweight Wide-angle Strobe Alternatives

25 posts
  1. Hi All,

     

    I've been shooting wide-angle with Dual Ikelite SS200/DS200 Strobes, and i love the output of them since i like to shoot in shallow waters. However they are heavy beasts to travel with and i'm after something lighter.

     

    Is there any streamlined/lightweight strobes that come close to the output of the 200's? How do Inon Z-240's compare?

     

    Does anyone know of any output comparison charts on the web for underwater strobes?

     

    Any suggestions appreciated on what strobes are the best for shallow water wide angle.

     

    Cheers,

     

    Peter

  2. Does anyone know of any output comparison charts on the web for underwater strobes?

     

    Have a look at this:

     

    Digital Diver Strobe Comparison

     

    According to this the in air guide number for the Z240 and DS200 is the same and the recycle time of the Z240 is slightly longer.

     

    If you want the lower colour temperature of DS200 to get nice blue backgrounds when shooting wide angle put a yellow filter behind the Z240's diffuser. Read this article by Alex Mustard:

     

    Strobes and Water Colour

    Edited by Gudge
  3. I feel your pain. I finally gave up on my beloved ss200s. I'm using the ds160s. Not quite as small as Z240s but close to the power of 200s and the same color temp.

  4. Thanks Gudge! That chart was exactly what i'm after.

     

    The air and uw guide numbers are intriguing...no guide number for the Z-240 underwater?? I gather guide numbers underwater depend on the penetration through the water, which the z240 may not be as high as the ss200's due to the differences in the cone reflector design??? Its the same coverage though, so...I really cant get my head around the theory. This chart claims Hartenberger strobes have absolutely no loss of light underwater??? huh?

     

    Anyway, Z240's are definently looking like the best replacement...i just hope they pack the same punch!

  5. I feel your pain. I finally gave up on my beloved ss200s. I'm using the ds160s. Not quite as small as Z240s but close to the power of 200s and the same color temp.

     

    The DS160's look good. Although, i love the ability to use AA's in the Z240's and the weight looks fantastic for travel. I'm not sure i'll give up my SS200's locally but they just wont get a seat on the plane. :laugh:

  6. Don't know what your camera and housing setup is like, so it is hard to give you a definitive answer.

     

    I was shooting with a Nikon D2x in an Aquatica Housing with two SS200 Sunstrobes which were upgraded to DS200 Sunstrobes at the factory with an electronic dual sync cord, fed through the Ikelite iTTL converter into an Ikelite bulkhead.

     

    I have since upgraded to a Nikon D7000 with an Aquatica housing and fibre optic bulkheads with Inon Z240 Type 4 strobes.

     

    My observations concerning the two setups to date.

     

    Big difference in TTL exposure limits between the Sunstrobes and the Inons in favour of the Inons. White underbellies of fish almost always burnt out with the Ikelite strobes but are handled very nicely with the Inons. For my purposes, I find the Inons to be more accurate as far as TTL exposures are concerned. Flash exposure compensation is more discreetly performed using the housing controls with the D7000 and Inons, although you can still reach up and adjust strobes individually if need be.

     

    Loved the colour of the Ikelites and have used theatrical lighting gels behind the diffusers on the Inons to warm them up. Setting the camera white balance to "cloudy" also can help, but I rarely do this.

     

    No more heavy gangly cables to deal with, although I sometimes worry how robust the fibre optic cables are. So far nothing to worry about here. Have tried using an electronic Sea n' Sea dual sync cord with the Inons and don't like inserting the cords into the flash unit at all. Pins in the Inons are very thin, fragile, and easy to break as has been my experience. Have since stuck with fibre optic on the new housing.

     

    No more proprietary battery packages. Have had to rebuild my Sunstrobe battery packs a couple of times as the price of new ones is a little to much to bear. I found 2500mah AA type batteries for the Inons and now recharge about 75% less than I did with the Ikelites. In practical terms, I am now recharging batteries every three to four dives with the Inons instead of after every dive with the Sunstrobes. I do monitor the charge in my batteries with a pulse load multi-battery tester and now only re-charge with they drop below 40%. Also AA type batteries can be found almost everywhere around the globe so when the batteries do fail, replacements are not hard to come by.

     

    Size and weight. The Inons are about half the weight of the Sunstrobes above water and are about twice the weight of the Sunstrobes below water. The Sunstrobes are positively buoyant underwater and Inons are negative by about a pound or two. I have added Stix floats to the arms to counteract this. Traveling with the Inons gives me an extra 4 pounds of baggage which by some airline standards can amount to as much as 10% of your allowable total. Not an insignificant amount these days. Smaller and compact means less stuff to drag through the airport too.

     

    Usability. Hands down to the Sunstobes. Minimum controls mean minimum configurations. Plug them in, turn them on, and your in business. With the Inons you very quickly get the impression this is a strobe the designers made to be all things to all people and there in lies one of it's major weaknesses. It can be too damn confusing. And the owners manuals (not one but two!) is one of the most poorly translated and written manuals I have ever read. It's a struggle to read and not much to be gleaned from it. I would recommend not buying the Inons immediately before a major trip because of the complexity in configuring the strobes. You do need to spend some time with them to get the most out of them.

     

    Bottom line for me. The Inons are not as powerful as the DS200s, but the additional features offset the loss in power. The DS200s now sit on the shelf (one of them is not functioning again). I could convert them to fibre optic with Ikelites new converter, but am not even considering that yet. The Inons are now my "go to" strobes. They may not be as powerful as the Sunstrobes (by about a stop) but the other advantages of the Inons keep me going back to them.

     

    Hope that helps.

  7. The air and uw guide numbers are intriguing...no guide number for the Z-240 underwater??
    It's hard to give a precise figure for underwater guide number as water clarity will effect it a lot, clear water guide numbers will be higher than dirty water guide numbers. When I got my first under water rig in 1980 the rule of thumb advised by Oceanic for my Oceanic 2001 strobe was to divide the air guide number by 3.3333 and I found that this worked well for me. Other manufacturers at that time advised dividing the air guide number by 2 but I found that this was being very optimistic.

     

    I just noticed an error in my previous post. When I stated:

     

    If you want the lower colour temperature of DS200 to get nice blue backgrounds when shooting wide angle put a yellow filter behind the Z240's diffusee.

     

    That should read "If you want the lower colour temperature of Z240 to get nice blue backgrounds when shooting wide angle put a yellow filter behind the Z240's diffuser

     

    Here's a shot of my two Z240s and S2000 alongside a friends DS125:

     

    584451220_KXxih-M.jpg

    Edited by Gudge
  8. Thanks Gudge! That chart was exactly what i'm after.

     

    The air and uw guide numbers are intriguing...no guide number for the Z-240 underwater?? I gather guide numbers underwater depend on the penetration through the water, which the z240 may not be as high as the ss200's due to the differences in the cone reflector design??? Its the same coverage though, so...I really cant get my head around the theory. This chart claims Hartenberger strobes have absolutely no loss of light underwater??? huh?

     

    Anyway, Z240's are definently looking like the best replacement...i just hope they pack the same punch!

     

    That chart is also inaccurate for quite a bit of the strobe specs. It also doesn't seem up to date. I have the Hartenberger 250TTL and Z240. I've also been using the Seacam Seaflash 150 and have used the 250, as well as the Subtronic Nova. The Z240 aren't the most powerful but for CFWA, it works well. You have to remember putting gels on also cuts light output. With gels that bring the lights to 4400k, 2 Z240 just matches 80% of the Hartenberger 250. The Inons packs a nice punch for the package but you have to put on the diffusers, which cut light to even up the beam. I think it's the most powerful strobe for the size, but power equals bigger size.

  9. Thanks for the comprehensive comparison Paul!

     

    On usabilty; I recently picked up an old SS400 and found it really simple to use with only three power settings and the switches at the back of the strobe. The SS200's and DS125's (the only other ike strobes i've used) both have the controls on the side, which make them difficult to access if you find your strobes in awkward positions. I rarely have my strobes pointing towards me, so it seems logical to put the controls at the back. The Z240's do seem to have overkill in its output settings..but no doubt this makes them more accurate when using ttl metering as you stated. I shoot full manual, so 3-4 settings mixed with aperture tweaks is getting me by at the moment, but i look forward to refining the art of lighting with the Z240's in the future.

  10. Here's a shot of my two Z240s and S2000 alongside a friends DS125:

     

    584451220_KXxih-M.jpg

     

    haha..its amazing that a 6 X subC battery pack can be replaced so efficiently and compactly by 4AA's!

  11. That chart is also inaccurate for quite a bit of the strobe specs. It also doesn't seem up to date. I have the Hartenberger 250TTL and Z240. I've also been using the Seacam Seaflash 150 and have used the 250, as well as the Subtronic Nova. The Z240 aren't the most powerful but for CFWA, it works well. You have to remember putting gels on also cuts light output. With gels that bring the lights to 4400k, 2 Z240 just matches 80% of the Hartenberger 250. The Inons packs a nice punch for the package but you have to put on the diffusers, which cut light to even up the beam. I think it's the most powerful strobe for the size, but power equals bigger size.

     

    Good point about the diffuser and gels, Drew! It will never feel right to light a traditional wide angle scene with anything that can't leave a sizeable bruise if you accidently headbutt it :D

  12. The old ikelite substrobes seem to be much wider in their light output than the z240s I have...but they weigh 3.9kg out of the water. They're definitely not going to be clocking up frequent flyer miles.

     

    The inons seem relatively bombproof, especially as I keep smacking them into the cave walls. Smaller is definitely better, and if they don't make as much light, that just means you need a few more. In the ocean, with the low light capabilities of the new dSLRs I haven't had any problems getting light on a wide angle picture in average temperate vis.

     

    Liz

  13. The old ikelite substrobes seem to be much wider in their light output than the z240s I have...but they weigh 3.9kg out of the water. They're definitely not going to be clocking up frequent flyer miles.

     

    The inons seem relatively bombproof, especially as I keep smacking them into the cave walls. Smaller is definitely better, and if they don't make as much light, that just means you need a few more. In the ocean, with the low light capabilities of the new dSLRs I haven't had any problems getting light on a wide angle picture in average temperate vis.

     

    Liz

     

    Well said Liz. I switched from DS125s to z240s for size an weight. I do think the Ikelite colour and beam coverage is superior for most of the WA shooting I do, but the size and weight of z240s on tex dives is hard to beat.

     

    After 2 years bashing through caves and wrecks the z240s have held up nicely, though at times their control system is a bit voodoo and it's easy to click a button and get them configured wrong.

     

    I still use the DS125s when colour temp or cycle time matter.

  14. Hi All - first time user and finding the forum a little daunting.

     

    I would welcome some advice on Wide Angle strobe/light options for the GoPro.

    Looking at the options I've kinda narrowed down to the Light Motion 1200 - but not locked in.

    Any ideas on what I should purchase for good light for stills and for video?

  15. ...I still use the DS125s when colour temp or cycle time matter.

     

    You can use Alex's (I think it was his??) trick of a 444 1/8th straw filter gel behind the z240 diffuser face, can't you? That's what I was planning on trying, from what I'd read.

  16. Hi All - first time user and finding the forum a little daunting.

     

    I would welcome some advice on Wide Angle strobe/light options for the GoPro.

    Looking at the options I've kinda narrowed down to the Light Motion 1200 - but not locked in.

    Any ideas on what I should purchase for good light for stills and for video?

     

    HI Dive Unchin, It might be worth starting another thread for your question about GoPro lighting. I'm sure many wetpixel members will be able to provide advice.

    Edited by Pfuller
  17. I can see how Z240's would be great for wrecks, caves, under ledges, and other low light situations - being compact and a good range of variable light output. But at full power shooting into the sun with small apertures, can they cut it? Anyone got any Z240 wide angled sunburst shots with a well lit foreground they can show off?

  18. Here's a few taken over the last couple of years:

     

    511543582_3bfH3-L.jpg

     

    739459284_UFXn4-L.jpg

     

    1170433682_TsgWW-M.jpg

     

    1170433703_c4etP-L.jpg

  19. name='Gudge' date='Nov 1 2011, 01:30 PM' post='294216']

    Here's a few taken over the last couple of years:

     

    Love the jelly, really really nice

    Bill

  20. I like the jelly too. I only shoot wide angle, and usually just with two Z240s on camera in the ocean - have a look at the tropical and temperate ocean galleries on my site http://photographyunderpressure.com/gallery. My strobes are 18 inches away each side of the camera and reaching to adjust them slows me down a bit, so I leave them on full power and adjust the camera accordingly instead. Here's one of mine from last weekend - not as cool as Gudge's, but lots of light in murky waters.

     

    6297113366_2b48d028af_b.jpg

    Edited by errbrr
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