Selling Images - or not...

FYI: I sold an image to a European inflight magazine by looking up what Alamy would charge, then taking off Alamy's theoretical 45% cut and quoting accordingly... I got the return I would have had from a run of the mill stock sale, and they paid less. Win Win situation

I like the idea of donating back for a worthy cause, particularly if the organization/charity has a tax-advantaged status so you can claim it as a deduction 8)

Thanks for posting that Craig.  Brandon Cole was the one that told me about charging non-profits for images and then donating the money back if you think the non-profit is a worthy cause.  So the "props" go to Brandon for that one.

 

Cheers

James

I like the idea too.

And, knowing Brandon that also does not shock me. Quality individual and very knowledgeable.

Check out Alan Briot's price list for fine art prints here:

http://www.beautiful-landscape.com

I'd personally be hesitant to grant unlimited use of a photo I really like, one-time usage rights seem much safer.

The thing is, if you only grant one-time usage rights and the customer decides to go ahead anyway and use your image for something else - it's easy, 'cause it's digital - are you prepared to sue them?

The recommendation (go for unlimited) came from an individual who was not and I'd guess that's at least 50% of the people here. And most importantly, you'd have to keep an eye on people you've sold images in the past - aka babysit - in order to even catch them, let alone sue them...

Cheers

James

The thing is, if you only grant one-time usage rights and the customer decides to go ahead anyway and use your image for something else - it's easy, 'cause it's digital - are you prepared to sue them?

Well... if the image in question is copyright registered (ie registed with the US copyright office, not just the right of ownership that comes with creation), I would go after them without getting lawyers involved...

Salient lesson and interesting presentation can be found here, on Sportshooter.com (warning, you'll want broadband)

Follow on to Part Four

and

Part Five (with a happy, and lucrative, ending)

This does bring in an important point. If we're all going to start talking the talk and walking the walk re: attempting to gain fair and consistent remuneration for images sold, it's important that we all keep in mind the things we need to do (like copyright assertion, not just sticking © SuperdooperScubashot.com on our images, which would not stand up in a court of law anyway...) to protect the rights that we are selling.

And part of that protection of rights is to keep an eye on the people you've sold images to, to ensure that they don't overstep the boundaries of the original agreement/contract.

This is turning in to a really interesting thread

Wow....

Ok, I have been gathering a lot of expereince over the past couple of years in this area and have been reasonably successful in selling quite a few images to a number of different markets.

Rule #1: Everyone pays if it is commercial/business including non-profits (although I do generally provide a discount for non-profits and causes I personally believe in).

Rule #2: If it is a student asking to use an image in her 4th grade report or similar I always thank them for the courtesey of asking and grant them the (very limited) right to use the image. They normally don't even ask for a high-res image for this.

Rule #3: Discount for multiple images

And lastly price setting:

I use the Hindsight's Price Guide 2 as my guide for price setting. It covers a lot of situations and then I adjust based on 'feel' (i.e. type of client, personal opinion of the quality of iage, etc). I don't use the numbers without thinking, but at least it gives me a solid idea of the amount I should be charging. You can download a demo of this product at http://www.hindsightltd.com/products/PriceGuide.html and if you sell one image you will likely recoup the cost of buying it.

Enjoy,

M

I was going to suggest the link paul mentioned....

I know that, for me, I have been approached numerous times askingto use an image. For schoolkids, I dig that, and make a point of thanking them for asking. I have had university aged people ask as well for a project, etc. and allow that.

I must not be a good salesman, though. I can think of four instances in the last year where I have been approached for use, and as soon as it turns to money talk, that kills the deal (or at least invites a polite declination... "given our needs and constraints, we have decided not to blah blah blah).

As someone who would like to see his images published, I find it very frustrating.

Chris

I hearya Chris. I get the same thing.

But what do you really lose, except the ego-boost of seeing your photo in print?

Cheers

James

OK, now lets turn up a different street but still in the same town.

What do you do to then market your photos to have someone ask? Do you actively send then to publishers or do they find you? Are you represented?

market your butt off! I am trying to do that at the moment. I am writing articles to go with every single photo i have ever taken it seems. The best thing to do is have a writing and photo package to give to editors.

Also don't just stick to Scuba mags, try everything.

I have representation with probably the best known Marine life stock agency but the checks don't roll in all that often.

To become successful selling photos, 5% is taking the picture, the other 95% is marketing and business savvy

What do you do to then market your photos to have someone ask? Do you actively send then to publishers or do they find you? Are you represented?

Since it isn't my full time job I try and make my efforts as efficient as possible. Scuba mags are tough to break into (lots of pros out there and it is a small tight market) and I hadn't bothered until recently when one of them approached me (and then I pursued it very rigourously and continue to do so). The majority of my success has been with textbooks and non-diving related magazines.

I initially became a member of a couple of photo marketing organizations that have 'want lists' - they send out daily requests from various sources. One also produces a book of photographers which it send to photo buyers which is a great way to get in front of people. Initially it looks like an expensive investment, but in the end it is cheap marketing and a cheap way to get to a lot of potential clients that you would likely never get to by yourself.

Once you have an opportunity to submit images for something in particular to a client, you now also have the opportunity to ask for additional opportunities with the same client. Many magazines have 'editorial calendars' of planned articles for the coming year which means many opportunities to submit images and plan for images you may get the opportunity to shoot before an article deadline.

My website is regularly updated with new images, has good search facilities and reasonable organizations and captioning. This means that your website should have a solid database behind it (I use PHOTOPOST which isn't bad at all) Captions MUST contain location, common names, important details and most crucial - SCIENTIFIC NAME. Without the scientific name you will miss a lot of opportunities especially from web searches. Image filenames MUST also be meaningful in some way for easy location of originals when requested - basicaly good cataloging.

I also paid for intial submissions for various websites which I stopped after 3 months - once the google/yahoo spiders get on your website they never go away.

I also create web galleries using the Web Gallery function of Photoshop for potential clients to allow them to browse specific images on request.

I am represented, but it has produced sporadic results - mainly because I don't spend a lot of time sending new submissions etc to my agencies. If it was my full time job I would be spending a lot more time pursuing this but I don't think I can currently justify the effort required to be top of an agencies mind who may represent a large group of photographers.

There is a lot of other little things I do as well, but this is plenty to get you started :-)

M

Wow, great insight.

I personally don't have the time nor inclination to persue this right now but I know many out there may have it in their mind to try. Who knows maybe some day.

Anytime ;-)