Nikon D70

I was consider buying a Nikon d2x or Canon ID Mark II camera, but am trying to establish if I really need that much.

Most of my photography comes is taken in hot clear places, i.e. Maldives or Egypt.

I have only really been using high end snap shot camera, and found that the colour loss is high, and the speed of the AF is unusably slow.

I was considering buying one of the 2 very high end camera, the help improve on these. Do i need one of the really high end cameras? or is something like a Nikon D70 good enough? and fast enought.

I would appreciate a response from Alexander Mustard, as you seem to have a lot of experience in these areas, and you work is fantastic.

Hi Jen,

First of all, since I don't remember seeing you before, welcome to the forum.

I am no Alex, but I will try to help you. I would say, if you have the money, and if you are serious about your photography, go ahead and buy the best system you can. But remember that the high end cameras have their cons, they are bigger and heavier than cameras like the D70 and Canon's 20D. Either way, a dSLR will be a huge improvement from your point and shoot camera, but there is also learning involved, so don't expect to get excellent shots immediately after you buy a new system.

The D70 is a good camera, it is slightly better than the D100, which is the camera that Alex used to get most of those amazing shots. But both the D2x and the 1D mkII are a lot faster. If you choose the 1DmkII, you can later upgrade to the 1Ds mkII and keep the same housing, and that's a big plus.

Now, if you give us a little more background about your photography, we will be able to help you more.

Luiz

I have a D70 that I use underwater and a D2X that I use topside. And I have no intention of housing the D2X because where I dive, water quality is the limiting factor in the quality of pictures I can take.

Thus, my take is that if all you plan to use your camera for is underwater, then a D70 or a 20D is probably all you need.

http://www.splashdowndivers.com/photo_gall...uipment_d70.htm

I use a D70 underwater and the AF is fast enough even in low contrast UK waters.

There is no doubt that the AF on the D2X is faster and from what Alex Mustard has written the picture quality is much better. It's really up to you to decide if you want to spend that much more money on your camera.

I agree with the comment that you will have to work at using the camera and on post processing to get the best out of a DSLR.

The lack of colour in your compact shots could be that you are just not getting close enough. Water saps the colour saturation very quickly. An external flash will help if you're not already using one, it's an essential on a DSLR set up.

Autofocus speed is not only dependent on the body but also the quality of the lens. The faster the lens, whether it is afs or not etc...

Tony

I upgraded from a Nikonos V w/ 15mm lens to a D70 over the winter. I have used the camera on two trips so far and love it. In January I used it on the Caribbean Explorer II in Saba and St. Kitts. In May of this year I used on the Shear Water in the Bahamas. I would not hesitate recommending this camera to anyone. Actually after the trip in January one of my friends decided to purchase a D70. He was looking to upgrade from an Olympus point and shoot to a Canon Digital Rebel. We actually had 4 D70 on the Shear Water the week I was on. You can see pictures from both trips at the following link. Go under Tropical and look for the Caribbean Explorer II and the Shear Water, Bahamas 2005. All photos on those are from the D70. The rest of the underwater portion of the site is Nikonos V.

http://www.bkuner.com

Happy shopping,

Jen,

About a year ago I too decided it was time to upgrade my uw camera system. I had been using a SEA&SEA MX10 for 3+ years and a Nikon F2 in Ikelite housing for 3-4 years.

I considered the Canon Digital Rebel, Nikon D70 and Olympus 5060 or whatever number they were on at the moment. I chose the Nikon D70 because #1: I couldn't imagine going back to a point and shoot after using a housed SLR. #2: It is soooo easy to use. #3: The price was right (and it's even better now). #4: I am familiar with Nikon cameras and lenses, and even though my old AIS lenses would not migrate to the D70 I liked the quality of Nikon lenses.

If you are a serious amateur photographer you will be happy with either the D70 or the Canon. Find someone who has one of those cameras. Borrow them and see how you like them.

My S.O. and I used our D70's (he had camera envy after I bought mine) on our recent Indonesia trip. You can check out the images at

http://www.divermaiden.com/indonesia/files...esiagallery.htm

Good luck in your camera purchase,

Kathy

The D2X and IDS Mk II are really serious cameras which take a lot of work to get the best from them. If you don't have any SLR experience then I would think this is real overkill.

The cost of going from having nothing to a full system with these cameras is very high with both the camera and housing being significantly more expensive.

In Uk terms D70 is only ca.£650 whereas D2X is £3300.

The housings are also much more expensive for the D2X and in short supply.

On top of this you need to buy lenses. (Same for both cameras).

A shopping list for Nikon might be:

10.5mm

12-24mm

60mm

105mm

which comes to around £2,000.

And then you need strobes and arms - around £600 each. You will want two.

So total system costs for D70 is probably around £6,000 while for D2X probably hitting around £10,000+

That is a significant difference.

My route has been to buy into the cheaper level camera while getting lenses, ports, strobes etc and then I will probably upgrade housing and camera when the next generation of cameras come along. The total cost of ownership will be less from a cashflow perspective then and hopefully I will have got to the point where I am outgrowing the serious amateur camera and ready for the full pro outfit.

The bottom line is that IMHO unless you are a top level photographer, like Alex, then YOU are the limiting factor not the camera.

I have given examples using Nikon, Canon would be more expensive because the MK II is more expensive than the D2X.

Mark

I agree with pretty much everything that has been said above. I use a D2x, but in every review I have written about it, I have said it is not the camera for everyone.

http://wetpixel.com/i.php/full/nikon-d2x-a...bal-nd2-review/

The D70 and Canon 20D are excellent cameras. And produce images that are good enough for double page spreads and magazine covers. Few people need much more. In addition remember that Doug Perrine won the Wildlife Photographer of the Year last year with a D60 - a camera few would consider these days.

The top line cameras are justifiable if you shoot enough and need the quality. Since getting my D2x I have downloaded 9800 underwater pictures (should have shot another 200 in Egypt to get to 10000!).

If you plan to take uw pictures for the long term, then most sensible place to start is with a good housing system. So when you choose to upgrade then you don't have to buy new ports etc.

Alex

I have the D70 and i shoot it a lot more than most. Sure i get frustrated with the AF, especially in low light at times but it works great for me. I have had quite a few shots published from that camera and all look good.

However, i don't really understand why everyone is saying not to get the D2X or the big Canon. If your friend asked you whether he should get a Ferrari if it was in his price range would you tell him not to bother because a Civic is fine?!

Come on people lets not let envy get in the way here. I see no problem with buying one of the pro bodies, its not that much of an upgrade in size/handling from D70 or 20D. Mine as well go with quality from the start instead of having to lose the money in selling body and housing of one of the smaller cameras when upgrading in the future.

My 3 cents!

Mike

Mike makes some important points. If people have earned their money then of course they have the right to spend it on what they want. And the only thing more expensivce than a D2x is buying a D70 first and then buying a D2x!

But if people ask what camera is right for them as a photographer - we should advise with photographic arguments. I think it is out of order to enviously criticise people once they have bought it, but before they have parted with the folding stuff it is the time to advise.

If you have a family of four and need to go shopping in town, then a Ferrari F430 might not be the right car! My room mate in the Red Sea had to take his wife and son out separately in the F430, but said it was an amazing piece of kit!

Alex

Hello Mike,

You could try the new D70 firmware, it makes the AF much faster that it used to be.

Best wishes to the mantas and to Bill!

Michel

However, i don't really understand why everyone is saying not to get the D2X or the big Canon.  If your friend asked you whether he should get a Ferrari if it was in his price range would you tell him not to bother because a Civic is fine?!

 

Mike

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Would you recommend the Ferrari to a 16 yr old that got his license yesterday

I would think that for someone getting started with dSLR photography it makes more sense to leave the $ in the bank and start with a quality intro camera like the D70 or 20D. By the time you have milked those cameras of their potential, and really can justify something more, The D2x might be cheaper or replaced. I believe in buying the best the you can afford, but huge files are not in the interest of a newbie, and the benefits of those huge files would be negligible. Further, the risk of flood would be higher with a newbie.

Mike - I think you own a D2x, so you are aware of the technique that the camera demands. This has been a real learning curve for me, and an uneccesary challenge to a beginner.

As a D70, if I was able to upragde to a d2x and not worry about the cost, the D70 would be collecting dust. OK it may be a steeper learning curve but hell, when you're standing at the bottom its only a bit steeper.

And yes, envious as hell

Just make sure that the damn thing is insured to the hilt before getting it wet - just in case!

Would you recommend the Ferrari to a 16 yr old that got his license yesterday

 

 

Mike - I think you own a D2x, so you are aware of the technique that the camera demands. 

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I might not recommend it but i don't know of a single 16 year old who wouldn't want one if they had the choice...did i mention i only own a mountain bike....now i have car envy!....

Me? Own a D2X???!!!! i work in the scuba industry!!!!

Lucky if i can afford a daily dose of ramen noodles....speaking of which, i haven't eaten in 48 hours....damn that visa card and the Sony HD camera and Amphico housing...

I agree with Mike here. If you can afford D2X and get a D70 now, you will end up getting a D2X anyhow. I upgraded to D2X eventhough D70 was perfectly fine. Did my skill justify the upgrade, definitely not. But in a long run, it is more expensive to go D70 route then upgrade to D2X in a year. $6000 practice system/experimental system is not cheap. If $12,000 for the system is a big deal, no, you don't really need it but if it is not a big deal, why not.

Sure there are a few more buttons to learn but it is not exactly rocket science.

A lot of people talk about needing a solid technique to shoot especially topside as the resolution of the D2X is incredible and any unsteadiness will show. I don't think the problem is that bad underwater consider how much lighter it is and the way you housing handles really help to steady the camera.

The housing is bigger (well, except for Sea and Sea DX70) but again, you don't need a lot of practice with D70 in order to drag the D2X around or manuever it.

However, before you buy it, just make sure that you don't really mind dragging a big set of camera with you (same apply for any dSLR system). A friend bought D70 system when a few of us did and in the end, she could not really be bother much with it and only use it once in awhile and I think that is a waste but if you are committed to use it a lot and practice, get the best system that you can afford.

If he gets a D70, would you recommend getting an Fantasea housing first to practice before spending big bucks on Seacam with their big viewfinder? Absolutely not. Go for the best system that you can comfortably afford, do it once and do it right!

PS, no I can't afford a Ferrari either but well, D2X is a lot more affordable than a Ferrari and if I can afford one, I rather have a Bentley Continental GT

God help me decide.

My skill level in underwater photography is not the best. Although, I have taken 3000 pictures this year. Using my Sony DSC p93 or C50Zoom. Although most of them have no colour, a lot of the shallow and close up ones are as good any one could expect.

The C50Zoom Leaked, just for everyones info.

I do have a lot of experience with digital technology in general. I help lots of digital photographers to lots of different things with images. From Juniors using Microsoft Digital Imaging, to changing DOF in Photoshop.

I also have commited myself to at least attemp to make money out of UW photo, and I want to be the best.

Also, everyone keeps saying d2x v d70. Is its a general opinion to stay away from the canon ID MkII?

Danny

Hi Danny -

I'll add my 2 cents. I have 2 d70's with nexus housings. I am selling one housing and d70 and have the d2x on the way. you would be able to use existing ports with an upgrade to d2x if you choose that path and be able to sell your old d70 housing without a problem to help defer costs. I have sold all of my older cameras and housings and lenses on wetpixel within days of posting. if fact, the d70 system is already sold. Im upgrading to larger 12MP to print bigger and because i do a lot of cropping.

M.

God help me decide.

 

 

I also have commited myself to at least attemp to make money out of UW photo,

 

Danny

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Ahhh, now we get to the root of it. My suggestion to make money...

Open a camera and housing shop!

Sounds to me like you have had quite a few dives with a camera. If you can afford the pro system whether its canon or nikon (not starting that debate again)

go for it.

Hi Danny -

 

  Im upgrading to larger 12MP to print bigger and because i do a lot of cropping.

 

M.

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Michael, save your money, get closer....