Nikon SB 800

Excellent info. I did get sent some lower readings from another person with a Minolta meter, but I think the relative values remain consistent. I'll try it with a bit of 81B gel.

Measurements were done with Eye1-Photo in flash mode...not the most accurate instrument out there, but relative differences (between the strobes should be +-accurate). All measurements were done with a Full dump, for e.g. the SB-800 showed some different colour temps depending on power setting [which also affects flash duration]

Yes, densitometry wasn't my favourite course either, to put it mildly.

I guess I was too dense for that class also, same with the zone system, of which I was in a different one most of the time in the 70's

I am experimenting with housed SB-800 at the moment and indeed the optical relay seem to be the way to go, altough not strong or wide they are neet economical way to get TTL for macro work and if you want to warm (cool) them off a bit get a sample filter booklet from Lee filter, their samples are the perfect size for the front end of the SB-800.

I still rely on my two DS 125 for wide but plan to bring along one if not two housed SB800 flashes on my next trip for macro use, which is where you would benefit the most from TTL anyway.

Here is the address for lee filter http://www.leefiltersusa.com/NewLightProdu...NewProdSWB.html

So the SB800 has at least some use, both for macro and the other is in considering weight limits in baggage (at least for us UK residents with such restricted limits) if it is also going to be needed on land.

Charles Stirling

Hi Guys,

I was just checking to see if Jack had been in the water and checked out that 1/4000sec setting on the SB800 combo?

I'm still not really following this warm and cool strobe thingie...

I understand the idea of the reflection of light color off the black body stuff, BUT, give it to me officially;

1. what is a warm strobe...degreesK and good for macro or wide angle?

2. what is a cool strobe...degreesK and good for macro or wide angle?

And then Alex mentions that you have to change the temperature settings in PS to compensate...

Bruce

I'm still not really following this warm and cool strobe thingie...

I understand the idea of the reflection of light color off the black body stuff, BUT, give it to me officially;

1. what is a warm strobe...degreesK and good for macro or wide angle?

Warm strobe is usually considered the one with a temp below 5000 (ikelite DS125, Subtronic Alpha...). Used to be considered better for WA because of its warmer-redder light. Nowadays, you can change your WB so you can use them perfectly for macro too (lowering your cameras WB temp)

2. what is a cool strobe...degreesK and good for macro or wide angle?

Cool strobe is the one with a temp over 5000 (inons, Sea&Sea...). Used to be preferred for macro (even Subtronic had an Alpha Macro version)

And then Alex mentions that you have to change the temperature settings in PS to compensate...

 

Bruce

I guess that what Alex means is that if your strobe is, for example 4400, the white things iluminated by it will have a "4400 white" so you should adjust your cameras white balance to 4400 to get a "true" image.

The thing gets trickier when you have a mixed light image (ths sun and your strobe) like a CFWA. This is when white balancing for your strobe will have a different effect on the part of the pic iluminated only by the sun wether is a cool or warm strobe. And this is when personal taste comes in and which "blue" water you prefer.... some people tend to prefer warmer strobes because they yield nicer blues but is a personal taste thing....

Hi Dave,

Thanks for the response. I think I'm on the right track now..hehehe.

Elsewhere in this thread, it is reported that the the SB800 has a Kelvin reading of 6000average approx.

I am assuming that this will be slightly less underwater. So, from what you suggest with the camera's WB, if I set the WB to a custom setting of around 5500K or somewhere near, I should have the correct colors when opened in PSE? Or is that over simplifying it?

Bruce

Elsewhere in this thread, it is reported that the the SB800 has a Kelvin reading of 6000average approx.

I am assuming that this will be slightly less underwater. So, from what you suggest with the camera's WB, if I set the WB to a custom setting of around 5500K or somewhere near, I should have the correct colors when opened in PSE? Or is that over simplifying it?

 

Bruce

I think Alex suggests that underwater the strobelight gets "bluer" so, if the SB800 has a temp of 6000 (which I am not sure of), maybe 6200-6500 (bluer than 6000) could work better... With an SB800 I prefer to shoot AutoWB (maybe it could be a good idea to shoot AutoWB+1).

All of this info is only important if you want your jpgs straight out of the camera to look good or real. But the best you can do is to shoot RAW and correct with the ACR.

I'm thinking about using a housed SB800 along with a Ikelite or Inon Strobe (I have both a DS125 and Z240) as filler for macro use. Both the SB800 and the other strobe would be wired to a D200 in a Subal housing via Nikonos 5 pin connections. I would run the SB800 using all 5 wires of the one side bulkhead set for TTL and the 'Other' strobe with the 3 wire connection for the other bulkhead and using it on external manual adjustment. Make sense? Any idea that I would have any problems with camera lock, incorrect setup, or problems doing this? I've read from other who are working using the SB800 for TTL macro use and an Inon (for example) for filler set as a slave but I don't know if they are fiber-optically setting off the Inon or if they have it wire to the hotshoe as I am proposing? Can both of the strobes be triggered from the hotshoe, just one with the 5 pin lead out and the other with the 3 pin?

Thank you very much for any help you can offer.

Paquito

My experience with trying to hard wire two strobes or flashes doesn't work, i'm thinking you should either go with the Inon and / or the Ikelite with the TTL slave (not shure about that one), but i've did some dry test with the Sb800 and a Inon 2000w and it seemed to work good, now i'm jerry rigging two SB800 in housings with one hard wired and the other optically cabled. so far so good, I still need to wet the whole rig to confirm but it looks good. if you opt for the Inon, you will have to fiddle with the magnet switch for the preflash, what I do is take picture of the Inon until the strobe output is visible in the shot, that mean your sync is good.

Thank you Jean.

Though I'm slightly confused. Right now with my Subal, I can plug in one Ikelite to one bulkhead, and the Inon to the second other bulkhead via a nikonos V cord (3 wire connection) on both leads. Though I have not done this yet, I really shouldn't have a problem doing so, I just don't get TTL and I run both strobes manually. Both are triggered via the hotshoe connection which is wired internally with both bulkheads connecting to the split and plugged into the top of the camera.

Are you saying that I would have a problem if I switched on of those strobes for the SB800? I understand that running two SB800's via the hard wire wont possibly give me TTL control out of both? But if I have just the one bulkhead with the fully connected 5 wire lead for TTL control reading the camera for use on the SB800 ~ and the other bulkhead side with only 3 wire connection for either the ike or inon strobe, wouldnt that work?

So in essence both a single SB800, and for example a single ikelite DS125, both hardwired, one for each bulkhead ~ (the SB800) getting TTL control and running the second (the DS125) via manual control (3 wire connection so as to not lock up the camera) as a filler for macro? I dont see why it wouldn't work but please if anyone knows to the contrary I would surely appreciate knowing.

I hope I didn't confuse and come across of trying to have both Inon and Ike off one bulkhead and the SB800 on the other, no no, not that at all. Just two strobes heads total not three.

Otherwise what I could do is as you suggest and hardwire the SB800 and run a fiber optic from the SB800 to slave the Inon? But I would like to clean it up more than that via the other way I am suggesting if that may work?

Sorry for all the naivete and confusion.

Paquito

Hi Paquito,

I am pretty sure from memory that Ryan from Reefphoto, explained to me that the Nikon camera will detect the second strobe if it is also hard-wired and not fire the SB800, that is why the second strobe has to be slave fired. This is trying to recall a phone conversation before a serious head injury, so you might want to give him a quick phone call. He is a really nice, helpful bloke...

Jean,

Does all this experimentation with the SB800 mean that we are likely to see an Aquatica housing in the not so distant future??

Bruce

Hi Bruce, Jean,

Thank you for the clarification, I will research some more. I am green, so thank you again for the help.

Cheers!

Hi Guys,

I went diving yesteray with the Nexus/D70S and SB800 i-TTL. Diving was around a large pier complex and resulted in mixed lighting, from sunlight to twilight under the pier.

Out of 89 images taken, there were 21 removed from the final cut...BUT, these were removed for compositional errors only! The rest of the images are all 'useable' out of the camera, and will only need minor RAW modification and some cropping to improve composition...

I'd say that the SB800 is a very useful tool underwater...

Bruce

Sorry to bring back the old thread, a lot of people asked about this interesting question related to SB800,

Jack and other guys have shown how to use duel SB800, and I did learn from it.

Like the Inon Z240 or other strobes, in general, TTL works better for macro.

For WA, I have heard from some of the Z240 users, TTL doesn't work as well.

In terms of power, here's some links, hope that it's useful for some of you (the other knew already).

Some back and white specs:

You can find and compare the Z240, DS125, DS200 from here,

http://www.digitaldiver.net/strobes.php

I do not have a v. good site for SB800, so I just refer the info from Nikon:

http://www.nikonusa.com/template.php?cat=1...;productNr=4801

If you look at the GN for these several strobes (Z240, DS125, DS200), SB800 IS powerful,

MAYBE the angle coverage may not be as good.

I just wondered, if anybody have try to add optics outside the SB800 housing for better coverage, reflector, lens etc. It may sound silly but I think if the flash is powerful, why not? Maybe it's not hard.

I will be getting an SB800 tomorrow and using it in a Fantasea housing. It is a very powerful strobe and the i-TTL is great. You can run two in i-TTL using an optical sync cord.

 

Here's an article on the setup.

 

SB800 dual w/optical link

 

Jack

 

PS; I see you're in Seattle, drop me a line and maybe we can get together and try this out a bit.

correct me if i'm wrong but the d200 and the D70 both have wireless commander as does the sb800, so you don't need cables and you can run something like 8 flashes if you really wanted to.

so why doesn't wireless commander work with the underwater housings?

Wireless commander DOES work with underwater housings. But it's pretty unreliable as the preflashes don't penetrate housing window + water as well as they penetrate air. That's why it helps to use fiber optic cables to help the light get from the commander flash to the slave flash.

Cheers

James

IR doesn't travel well UW. It will travel along a F.O. cable.

I would agree with the assessment that the SB800 is powerful, but doesn't have as wide an angle of coverage as the z240. But for macro and close-in the i-TTL is just awesome. It also is linked to the lens and camera and focuses the light depending on your zoom /lens size.

Arguments that it doesn't have as warm a color temp, etc are cheaply corrected with a bit of filter gel in the housing. I also use a bit of diffuser filter as well for softer light.

Jack

I think Nikon iTTL uses visible light, not infrared.

Cheers

James

The TTL determination uses visible light (as it must), but Nikon's CLS communications are infrared. CLS tells each strobe when to emit their TTL preflashes, when to fire, and for how long. All that's done via IR. With CLS, you can use multistrobe configurations, set relative levels between the strobes, and have all strobes controlled via TTL. Very cool if you can get the IR to work underwater.

I can't really see the utility of CLS and fast strobe sync if the strobes themselves are unsuitable for wide angle. If we could get a CLS-compatible big strobe, like a DS-200 or YS-250, then I'd be excited. We need wide coverage, excellent power, then fast shutter sync. With fast shutter speeds the effective output will be reduced unless the full dump speed of the strobe tubes is very fast as well.

BTW, CLS strobes can be hardwired as well. The Nikon CLS commander offers two wired strobe ports. Anyone doing a custom CLS underwater strobe would be better off using IR and fiber than figuring out how to adapt sync cord IMO.

Guys

I have noted several comments regarding the beam angle of the SB800 being too narrow for wide angle. I use a D70 in a Subal housing with a single housed SB800. My all time favourite lens is the 10.5mm which is wide angle by anyone's definition. I have found the SB800 to give fair to good coverage with this lens. The maximum coverage of the strobe is approx that of a 17mm lens with the cover flap down, and 24mm with it up. Power wise I have not yet had any issues, but then the bulk of my shooting is in temperate waters where one is generally closer to the action. I've yet to add a 2nd strobe, although I will admit to having needed one on a few occasions.

Rgds

Jean.