d200 setup

I'm looking at getting my D200 into a Subal ND20 housing and underwater.

My ND2 a massive beast to handle sometimes, and I would like to get something nearer in size to my old film N70 housing. I'm not convinced on a few points though and would like to hear what people with the D200/ND20 combo think.

My main concern is the battery life of the D200 ... I find it frustrating topside, how does it go unerwater? How many shots are you getting on a macro setup? Are you using AF?

Next big one is lighting ... I have a couple of options at the top of my list ... ikelite DS125 or sea&sea YS90

For the Ikes

• I'm addicted to the modelling light
  
• the battery life is fantastic
  
• I could use the ike ttl adaptor cable?
  

against

• they're big and heavy (remeber my aim was to have a smaller more manouverable rig)
  
• I'd have to buy
  

For the Sea & Sea

• I have one and I like the images it made with my old camera
  
• its lighter and smaller. easrier to get in tight spots and to work on loc-line arms
  
• It would work with the S&S TTL converter
  
• I have one which would otherwise ba a doorstop
  

Against

• no modelling light
  
• battery life
  

yes and there's INON and other options too of course

hmmmmm ...

either way i'd still have to buy stuff, but what road to go down ...

Have you looked at the Subal D80 housing? It looks tiny! There's a hands on (dry) review in UWPmag this month.

Cheers

James

I have a D80 w/S&S housing and dual YS-90DX strobes....

a couple of my friends have D200's...the D80 setups are slightly smaller and lighter..

regarding the Ys-90Dx battery life, it lasts for 3 dives no problem (up to 100 shots per dive), and that's keeping the strobe on full power...they are negative underwater, which is nice when you have a heavy D80/D200 setup...

here's some photos I just took in bali with the D80/Ys-90dx's

http://www.scottpenny.smugmug.com/Underwater/312691

they worked pretty good for wide angle

only downside is that for wide-angle, strobes can never be powerful enough , I'm pretty sure the DS-125's are more powerful...

regarding the modeling light, most people I know don't point the strobes right at the subject, so they don't use the modeling light features like they thought they would, they use their focus light...

Scott

I keep hearing complaints about battery life with the D200 and I guess I'm not sure what the complaint is (or what I'm missing)? I can take hundreds of shots with my D200 between charges. The 4GB memory card runs out before the battery by a long way. Anyway it is a non-problem for me.

I also use YS-90's. With rechargable batteries they'll go a couple days. Or at least I change them after 4 dives or so. They would last longer but my batteries are starting to get a little old and don't hold a charge as well as they used to. But they give great coverage for WA shots with lots of adjustability in output.

Can't comment on the converter issue (never used one) but it would be nice for macro.

Rick

I get a good 350+ images with my D200 between charges, it's set to capture both high jpg and Raw at the same time, I also have the LCD preview display for 10secs after each shot.

regards

Gary

On the battery issue I have owned my D200 for 17 months and use it for terrestrial photography. When I started using the D200 I was deceived by my previous experinces with other cameras. With the D200 the battery meter on the LCD of the camera shows the actual amount of charge left. So if you have shot 150 images in raw and the the camera shows 50% charge remaining then there is probably close to another 150 images left to take on that battery. With my Fuji S2 when the meter starts to show a change from full it means that the batteries are close to being empty of charge. Like the Fuji S2 my D2X battery meter is not as accurate as the D200 meter. The Subal ND2 is very much smaller and lighter than my Aquatica. The Subal ND20 housing I have seen recently looks noticeably smaller than the ND2. I can imagine that it would be a pleasure to own. Good luck.

vr/ Andy

Lndr,

The Subal ND20/Nikon d200 is my first DSLR setup. I've taken a lot of wide angle pics of manatee with it and recently polished off some macro baptism/configuration/practice with the 105vr/60mm, new 105vr port, Kenko teleconverters, etc., with significant success.

Here is what I know;

The ND20 is quite a bit heavier underwater than the ND2 because of less air space, etc. So if you want a rig more maneuverable just know it might be smaller but not necessarily easier to handle once you submerge it.

That said I combined a few options (great help and ideas from members of this forum); and got the rig nice and light and balanced just right even with the 2X TC/105vr/new Subal port, which is a heavy setup for even strong guys.

I know a strong guy who recently took the Subal ND20 down with Kenko 2XTC/105vr/ Inon strobes and no added buoyancy and he said he couldn't even turn the thing to portrait mode he had to keep his hands locked on the handles for landscape - it was the only way he could maneuver and control the heavy super-macro setup underwater.

That said the Subal ND20 is lighter in the water than many of the other d200 housings (notably Sea and Sea, Aquatica and Hugyfot are very very heavy in water as far as their d200 housings go); and the Subal ND20 is pretty ergonomic to handle once the weight issues are worked out in my experience.

I used to have Inon d2000ws but I traded them in for the Sea and Sea 110s. I'm glad I did because the Sea and Sea 110s are quite a bit lighter and your YS90s would even be a few ozs lighter still! I liked the Inons but the weight was a bear. The Sea and Sea 110s are OK, not my fav but OK for now.

Just FYI, I know someone else who sold his d200 setup (Sea and Sea for d200) to get an ND2!!!!!!! Yup, just cause the d200 was too negative for him and the ND2 even though it was much bigger is lighter in the water and easier for him to handle.

Best, Carol

PS - Re: Battery life, not a huge problem EXCEPT when you use the VR a lot with the 105vr - the VR eats up the battery life but I still haven't exhausted it on a shallow two hour dive - still I don't know if the battery would make it through two very long dives with lots of use of the vr? Would probably depend how much auto focusing was done and how much hunting - manual focusing and AF-locking it while in continuous focus seem to save a lot of battery life with the 105vr in my experience.

Have you looked at the Subal D80 housing? It looks tiny!

Thanks James, its a good suggestion. The cameras look sooo similar. If I didn't have a D200 & big CF cards already I'd probably go this way.

I have a D80 w/S&S housing and dual YS-90DX strobes....

 

regarding the Ys-90Dx battery life, it lasts for 3 dives no problem (up to 100 shots per dive), and that's keeping the strobe on full power...they are negative underwater, which is nice when you have a heavy D80/D200 setup...

 

here's some photos I just took in bali with the D80/Ys-90dx's

http://www.scottpenny.smugmug.com/Underwater/312691

 

they worked pretty good for wide angle

 

only downside is that for wide-angle, strobes can never be powerful enough , I'm pretty sure the DS-125's are more powerful...

 

regarding the modeling light, most people I know don't point the strobes right at the subject, so they don't use the modeling light features like they thought they would, they use their focus light...

Thanks for posting the photos Scott.

It looks like you had plenty of light on the macro & fish ... maybe not so even on some of the really wide reef stuff, but thats what I'd expect I'm mainly wanting a macro rig, so I'm not worried about the not-so-big bang

I was finding my YS90 wasn't keeping up with a double dive when I fist got the my digital setup, but this was probably because I was so snap happy ...

I do however like being able to use my ike strobes as a spotting light and on night dives

I keep hearing complaints about battery life with the D200 and I guess I'm not sure what the complaint is (or what I'm missing)? I can take hundreds of shots with my D200 between charges. The 4GB memory card runs out before the battery by a long way. Anyway it is a non-problem for me.

 

I also use YS-90's. With rechargable batteries they'll go a couple days. Or at least I change them after 4 dives or so. They would last longer but my batteries are starting to get a little old and don't hold a charge as well as they used to. But they give great coverage for WA shots with lots of adjustability in output.

Thansk Rick, The battery lkife is real short compared to the D2x, so maybe that's what makes people notice. I find it uses more power when its off - and at first I was surprised when it was going flat in my camera bag Definitely the 70-300 on AF & VR chews the battery pretty quick!

I used to have one ys-90 which did everything ... just at a different "pace". I actually miss the ?soft? lighting sometimes

I get a good 350+ images with my D200 between charges, it's set to capture both high jpg and Raw at the same time, I also have the LCD preview display for 10secs after each shot.

Thanks Gary, that's pretty much how I'd be shooting

On the battery issue I have owned my D200 for 17 months and use it for terrestrial photography. When I started using the D200 I was deceived by my previous experinces with other cameras. With the D200 the battery meter on the LCD of the camera shows the actual amount of charge left. So if you have shot 150 images in raw and the the camera shows 50% charge remaining then there is probably close to another 150 images left to take on that battery. With my Fuji S2 when the meter starts to show a change from full it means that the batteries are close to being empty of charge. Like the Fuji S2 my D2X battery meter is not as accurate as the D200 meter. The Subal ND2 is very much smaller and lighter than my Aquatica. The Subal ND20 housing I have seen recently looks noticeably smaller than the ND2. I can imagine that it would be a pleasure to own. Good luck.

vr/ Andy

Thanks Andy, thats useful info. I've been doing unatural things to my d200 like long exposures and using my telephoto with VR. I mainly notice the battery when its too dead to work Haven't really done any shooting equitable to UW stuff!

The size is definitely an attraction ... I have loved my subal housings (except for the price) though I haven't had other SLR housings.

The ND20 is quite a bit heavier underwater than the ND2 because of less air space, etc. So if you want a rig more maneuverable just know it might be smaller but not necessarily easier to handle once you submerge it.

Thanks Carol, the weight point is interesting. My main thing with the ND2 is the size, particularly the couple of extra inches at the bottom. I get frustrated at not being able to get the same angle on my small stuff shots

That said I combined a few options (great help and ideas from members of this forum); and got the rig nice and light and balanced just right even with the 2X TC/105vr/new Subal port, which is a heavy setup for even strong guys.

so what have you done that's got it balanced? I'd really like to hear what's working

I know a strong guy who recently took the Subal ND20 down with Kenko 2XTC/105vr/ Inon strobes and no added buoyancy and he said he couldn't even turn the thing to portrait mode he had to keep his hands locked on the handles for landscape - it was the only way he could maneuver and control the heavy super-macro setup underwater.

oooo ... that's a worry. I can get my ND2/60/DS125s in portrait with one hand ... but I really need two hands to get a steady shot either way. And I'm no guy (strong or otherwise)

That said the Subal ND20 is lighter in the water than many of the other d200 housings (notably Sea and Sea, Aquatica and Hugyfot are very very heavy in water as far as their d200 housings go); and the Subal ND20 is pretty ergonomic to handle once the weight issues are worked out in my experience.

*phew*

makes me even more keen to hear how you've got it rigged ... have you posted it somewhere else?

I used to have Inon d2000ws but I traded them in for the Sea and Sea 110s. I'm glad I did because the Sea and Sea 110s are quite a bit lighter and your YS90s would even be a few ozs lighter still! I liked the Inons but the weight was a bear. The Sea and Sea 110s are OK, not my fav but OK for now.

Just FYI, I know someone else who sold his d200 setup (Sea and Sea for d200) to get an ND2!!!!!!! Yup, just cause the d200 was too negative for him and the ND2 even though it was much bigger is lighter in the water and easier for him to handle.

i'm not sure my decisions getting any clearer

PS - Re: Battery life, not a huge problem EXCEPT when you use the VR a lot with the 105vr - the VR eats up the battery life but I still haven't exhausted it on a shallow two hour dive - still I don't know if the battery would make it through two very long dives with lots of use of the vr? Would probably depend how much auto focusing was done and how much hunting - manual focusing and AF-locking it while in continuous focus seem to save a lot of battery life with the 105vr in my experience.

yeah, that'd equate to my experience with the 70-300. For macro I don't use AF. Not sure if I would use the VR or not I have no idea how people get the amazing photos the do with AF ... I'm in awe ... I can't make it do my bidding!

Leander

I have the Subal ND20, for me the weight thing has not been an issue, but I do a lot more WA than macro.

I have never run out of battery power in a day of diving, but imagine it's possible. I always keep a spare charged, and do not use the LCD more than neccessary and keep the auto time for the LCD down to 10s.

Strobes are subtronics, big I know, but underwater are close to neutral, and very powerful and wide for the stuff I like to shoot. I use ULCS buoyancy arms with them.

so what have you done that's got it balanced? I'd really like to hear what's working

oooo ... that's a worry. I can get my ND2/60/DS125s in portrait with one hand ... but I really need two hands to get a steady shot either way. And I'm no guy (strong or otherwise)

*phew*

makes me even more keen to hear how you've got it rigged ... have you posted it somewhere else?

 

I didn't realise the INON were heavy. Compared to my Ike 125s Matts Inon is a featherwieght. Are they deceptively negative?

 

i'm not sure my decisions getting any clearer

yeah, that'd equate to my experience with the 70-300. For macro I don't use AF. Not sure if I would use the VR or not I have no idea how people get the amazing photos the do with AF ... I'm in awe ... I can't make it do my bidding!

 

Leander

Leander,

Yea, I just say "strong guys" when I note an experience with the d200 u/w cause I don't want people to think I'm just a weakling and that is why I have the negative, in-water weight issues!!

I actually thought of getting a D2X and the ND2 right after purchasing the ND20 and the d200 - because of the negative in-water weight issues. But even selling it almost new I faced losing so much $$$ and my husband who isn't a photographer or diver was past his "limit" so I just figured out how to make the best of the ND20/d200. As you say it does have a couple of less inches at the bottom for shooting up.

I'm sorry I haven't posted pics of my d200/ND20 macro rig yet. I'm notoriously slow at getting caught up with pics/posts and I haven't even shot a pic of the rig yet. Briefly with the new 105vr port/Kenko 2X TC w 2 ex rings which allowed use of the manual focus knob; to get the rig "neutral" I used 1-Patima BC on each 8" ULCS arm segment (search for those on this forum); 4 pieces of corecell foam on the other two 8" arms (equalled 7oz of additional non-compressible buoyancy); and Ryan Canon cut me a buoyancy ring for the 105vr port (it had to be all attached to the front, in front of the focus knob to keep use of the focus knob - but it worked quite well and the critters actually began to think I was just another piece of "flotsam" on the bottom!! - that gave me another 8 oz + non-compressible buoyancy to the front of the rig). I liked the combination of compressible and non-compressible buoyancy as I can "dump" some of the buoyancy when photoing critters in four feet of water (you don't want a rig too positive then for sure!) I suppose you could use the new ULCS buoyancy arms also but I'd have to get longer lengths to make more of a difference from what I have and I like the 2X 8" arms - I don't really want to go longer.

I need to do a post/picture of my setup - but not till after I'm done painting in my condo......., it will be another week or so, I can't even get to my housing right now.

There are specs on the in-water weight of the Inons and the Ike 125s, but as I recall the Inon specs were not "true"....?? They are heavier than stated. But I think they are about the same as the Ike's in-water, not sure though? The Inons are light on land but there are no air spaces to speak of so they are like little bricks on the ends of your strobe arms in the water (I shot many, many frames on over 200+ dives with them on my old Fuji F810 and I know how heavy they really are).

Yes as Loftus says with the wide angle the ND20 isn't too bad, negative weight wise (but for me it is still a problem for wide - not being a "strong guy" and all!!! ) When the ND20 really gets heavy is with the 105vr and super macro accouterments, but even with the 60mm lens the ND20 is way too negative for me without some modifications.

Got to get my house renovations done so I can post pictures again!!!

Still all in all I like the Subal ND20, all the d200 housings are quite negative except maybe Ikelite - best choices are probably the Subal or the Nexus - weight wise, but the Light and Motion might be lighter in water because it has more air spaces - but it is a larger housing. Yes, the choices are not clear. If I were you I'd probably stay with the ND2, it will probably be easier to handle in the long run. Or get a hold of an ND20 and take it down with 105vr and arms, etc and see for yourself????

Take Care, Carol

Hi Leander

I'm using the D200/ND20 combination with a pair of Inons and a Fixeye 48. I love it! Weight does not seem an issue underwater. As for battery life, I did two dives with the seals off Montague Island this weekend just gone by and filled my 2GB card. No battery problems at all. There was plenty of power left - it actually seemed better than topside! But maybe thats because I usually use the 18-200 VR topside and had the Nikkor 12-24 on the go underwater.

I'm using the D200/ND20 combination with a pair of Inons and a Fixeye 48. I love it! Weight does not seem an issue underwater. As for battery life, I did two dives with the seals off Montague Island this weekend just gone by and filled my 2GB card. No battery problems at all. There was plenty of power left - it actually seemed better than topside! But maybe thats because I usually use the 18-200 VR topside and had the Nikkor 12-24 on the go underwater.

Thanks Tim,

I forgot you had a D200. Its good to hear you love your setup!

I'd like to get at least two dives and probably a minimum of 4GB (not always needed, but often used) on a day out diving - so I'm hoping I can do that and from the posts it seems possible.

What arms are you running with the Inons?

I'm sure the 12-24 would have been heaps of fun with the seals!! Come to think of it, last time I dived with the seals @ Montagure I only had one of those disposable underwater cameras

cheers

Leander

Got to get my house renovations done so I can post pictures again!!!

Thanks Carol for all the info!! I hope the renos go well so you can dive again and post rig pictures too

I think for me I am leaning toward the Ike 125's. Though having a spare YS 90 in the cupboard might mean that's what I'll have to play with at first

I'm really thinking the size is the thing that I want, so a bigger rig for more bouyancy doesn't appeal (I reserve the right to eat my hat on that one!)

Thanks for your positive feedback Loftus, Its good to hear that the bouancy and battery are working for you

Leander

Leander,

FWIW, I am shooting the D200 in a Sea & Sea housing. I have dual INON Z220's. I shoot the Nikon 60mm (in the NX Custom Flat Port), the Nikon 105mm VR (in the NX Custom Flat Port with the XS extension ring), and the Tokina 10-17 FE (in the 8" dome with the XS extension ring). When I shoot the 60mm or the 105mm I use a Fisheye fixlight.

I have never noticed a weight problem with this system in any configuration. I shoot a lot of shots in portrait. I have never had a problem futsing around with the settings while composing a shot in portrait. I routinely change focal points, f-stops, and shutter speed while composing a shot.

As far as battery life is concerned, I just did 4 dives this past weekend (2 Saturday & 2 Sunday) using the Tokina & the new 105mm, and I forgot to change batteries from Saturday to Sunday. This was after doing some land photography on this battery the weekend before.

I was shooting strictly RAW on an 8gig card. I was shooting Sailfin Blenny's that were displaying so I was doing a lot of rapid fire shooting. Although the battery is low, it still has some charge left in it. I would not dive with it before changing out the battery, but I'd say that the battery life seems pretty good to me. Of course I have never shot the D2X before so I have no comparison. I jumped from the F100 right into the D200.

YMMV

fisheyeview

Hi Leander

 

I'm using the D200/ND20 combination with a pair of Inons and a Fixeye 48. I love it! Weight does not seem an issue underwater. As for battery life, I did two dives with the seals off Montague Island this weekend just gone by and filled my 2GB card. No battery problems at all. There was plenty of power left - it actually seemed better than topside! But maybe thats because I usually use the 18-200 VR topside and had the Nikkor 12-24 on the go underwater.

Great Tim, well just shows some people are really strong (and some are not!! )

Leander and Tom, I do know that when the 12-24 with extension ring is used on the ND20 is it significantly less negative in the water because the extension ring adds an air space and some buoyancy for the 12-24 lens at least. I use the 16mm and no ex ring and my entire wide angle setup ND20/Fe2 dome etc (without fisheye fix light but with Sea and Sea 110s & 4X 8" regular ULCS arms) is almost 4 lbs negative in the water, thus for me buoyancy corrections in the water even for wide angle (I was injured last year - hand strain injury - so I have to be more careful........). With Tim's Inons it would be more than 4 lbs negative, but then he is using the 12-24 with extension ring so maybe it is only just over 3 lbs negative for him - not a lot to fuss about for most people.

What I really would like Tim to do is take down the 105vr with the focus light/Inons etc, even better add in a TC, but even with the 105vr/new Subal 105vr port the ND20 will be heavy, heavy (but not as heavy as Sea and Sea, Hugy or Aquatica with the 105vr). But as said, some people are stronger than others for sure!!

You will see on DIY that Okuma deemed it necessary to add over 3 lbs of buoyancy (looks like) to his ND20 (looks like he had the 60 on, not sure - quick glance). Ryan Canon and I were talking about that - some people can easily handle a rig that weighs over 5+ lbs underwater and some people can actually get injured doing a similar thing. So it is a personal thing. Frankly I don't see any need to strain muscles at depth, in fact I see it as a detrimental thing. An orgainization I dive for here in the states (NOAA - National Oceaniac and Atmospheric Administration), actually has some crazy rule that you have to use lift bags for any weight over a few lbs. I don't remember exactly but it was around or under 10 lbs. Since "most" NOAA divers are really burly guys I thought that is was silly to have that rule, until I took the physics part of their tests and realized that even seemingly small weights brought up from depth can be quite injurious, especially if done repeatedly.........

OK --- enough of this, yes Leander I have to go apply another coat of paint in the hall - YUCK!

Carol

PS - and yes the battery life hasn't been a problem except with the VR on, and don't leave the camera even in the on position on the boat because VR chews up the battery even with just the camera turned on.

Leander,

 

FWIW, I am shooting the D200 in a Sea & Sea housing. I have dual INON Z220's. I shoot the Nikon 60mm (in the NX Custom Flat Port), the Nikon 105mm VR (in the NX Custom Flat Port with the XS extension ring), and the Tokina 10-17 FE (in the 8" dome with the XS extension ring). When I shoot the 60mm or the 105mm I use a Fisheye fixlight.

 

I have never noticed a weight problem with this system in any configuration. I shoot a lot of shots in portrait. I have never had a problem futsing around with the settings while composing a shot in portrait. I routinely change focal points, f-stops, and shutter speed while composing a shot.

 

As far as battery life is concerned, I just did 4 dives this past weekend (2 Saturday & 2 Sunday) using the Tokina & the new 105mm, and I forgot to change batteries from Saturday to Sunday. This was after doing some land photography on this battery the weekend before.

 

I was shooting strictly RAW on an 8gig card. I was shooting Sailfin Blenny's that were displaying so I was doing a lot of rapid fire shooting. Although the battery is low, it still has some charge left in it. I would not dive with it before changing out the battery, but I'd say that the battery life seems pretty good to me. Of course I have never shot the D2X before so I have no comparison. I jumped from the F100 right into the D200.

 

YMMV

fisheyeview

Fisheye and Leander,

Just for the record the guy who told me that he couldn't turn the super-macro setup (ND20/105vr/Kenko TC/ and Inons/Fix Light) to portrait is someone Fisheye knows quite well I think!! Again different configurations - I think Sea and Sea made that 105vr extension to help with ergonimics and weight of the heavy lens.

And as far as handling the ND20/105vr etc in supermacro in portrait again it will not be tack sharp if the rig is too heavy or too light for that matter - of course combined with other skills of course. My first super-macro shots with the balanced rig came out quite acceptable - I was surprised. But then I wasn't fighting to hold the rig, etc.

But as Fisheyeview says YMMV!! And it does! Best thing is to test a rig and/or keep on working on yours till you have it right for you. Cor Bosman even had to add buoyancy to his ND2 and that is a lot less negative in the water than the ND20 - but again it is all a decision as too what is best for each diver himself/herself.

Got to go paint, double yuck!!!

Carol

Fisheye and Leander,

 

Just for the record the guy who told me that he couldn't turn the super-macro setup (ND20/105vr/Kenko TC/ and Inons/Fix Light) to portrait is someone Fisheye knows quite well I think!! Again different configurations - I think Sea and Sea made that 105vr extension to help with ergonimics and weight of the heavy lens.

 

And as far as handling the ND20/105vr etc in supermacro in portrait again it will not be tack sharp if the rig is too heavy or too light for that matter - of course combined with other skills of course. My first super-macro shots with the balanced rig came out quite acceptable - I was surprised. But then I wasn't fighting to hold the rig, etc.

 

But as Fisheyeview says YMMV!! And it does! Best thing is to test a rig and/or keep on working on yours till you have it right for you. Cor Bosman even had to add buoyancy to his ND2 and that is a lot less negative in the water than the ND20 - but again it is all a decision as too what is best for each diver himself/herself.

 

Got to go paint, double yuck!!!

 

Carol

Hey Carol - if you'd like to supply the 105VR I'd be more than happy to test drive the setup for you

I'm a simple straight 105 man - probably because I bought it two weeks before $*^&% Nikon announced the 105VR. You can never win eh? Cameras and computers! Tsk.

On the arms, Leander, I'm using the straightforward Ultralights: 1x5" and 1x 8" for each Inon. But if negative buoyancy becomes a real problem, you could always switch to the buoyant Ultralight arms I guess.

I must admit I've not had a problem with negative buoyancy on my system with any of the lens/ports that I use - 10.5mm, 12-24, 17-80, 60 with the FP90 and 105 with the FP90 and a 30mm ring. And I'm no Charles Atlas. Although I do enjoy a couple of whippets for breakfast.

Re weight UW, I shoot a D200 in a Hugyfot with dual Z240:s and 'regular' arms (no floaters). For the record, I shoot almost exclusively with domeports at the moment. I find this rig very easy to handle UW (on land is a diffrent affair, phew!!). I can easily hold it with one hand for long times UW, and I'm not the big, weight lifting type. I wouldn't worry too much about weight.

/c

My ND20 with housing for the 17-55(7 cm extention ring and dome port) is to heavy. I am currently waiting for the 105VR Subal port to arrive and I presume thinks won't get any better with the 105.

It would be so nice to have a neutral system, the weight is really the only problem I have with this configuration - I am very happy with it.

Carol's buoyancy rings seem an interesting option, they shouldn't add to much bulk.

Carol, could you detail a bit about them (let your famous technical side speak ). They ware custom made ? Which kind or material are they made of, where did you find it.