Bahamian Rhapsody

While I usually do instigate controversial threads, I do think that the thread has been veered away from Bruno's video and more about politics of diving. I mean, there are 3 JackAss movies and a plethora of antic themed shows so obviously there are people who appreciate videos of this nature. Not that I'm saying that Eric likes JackAss movies, but he is allowed to, despite his 'status' (which I'm not sure what status that is...homeless? single?). Why does Eric have to defend himself for finding something funny? I mean, is he or anyone else running for office? Does everyone have to state their beliefs/positions on every issue every time they post? This is a forum and the movie, however inane to some, is funny to others. For those who have issues with the safety and disrespect for sea life, write to the BDA and the operators. Why put someone on the spot for thinking it's funny because you are appalled by it?

Now if Eric was one of the karate divers, then I would question his technique since I believe he's more into wushu shaolin styles and we all know crane and snake boxing kicks ass over karate. Sorry Cor, silat is for posers

Finally please do not compare the incident of Markus Groh to this incident, unless you know what happened in that incident. That sort of association is never substantiative or even helpful.

Afterall, all those opposed to shark diving in general (and I'm one of them) would think activity like this is bad in general. And I still speak to almost everyone who does it regularly... except Shawn now.

Most importantly, I'm most peeved that so many admin and mods have read this thread DID NOT put this in the video subforum, where video sharing should be.

I dont really get the endless karatechopping..but i guess you had to be there

Even if I were there, I would've done taichi... more serene than chops and the 'qi' flow would've shown in the water. If I used 'qi' to deflect a shark, I wouldn't be officially touching it.

If there is an environmental film project to do, Eric is at the top of my call list.

Biatch, you mean that man purse carrying dude is above me on the list?

Ok now that it's in the right subforum, please comment on the content and editing of the video.

Now if Eric was one of the karate divers, then I would question his technique since I believe he's more into wushu shaolin styles and we all know crane and snake boxing kicks ass over karate. Sorry Cor, silat is for posers

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Drunken fighter everytime.. You can take on multiple assailants and using a special 'Chi' technique not feel a thing until the next morning...

Dive safe

DeanB

Finally please do not compare the incident of Markus Groh to this incident, unless you know what happened in that incident. That sort of association is never substantiative or even helpful.

Drew,

I do not think anyone has 'compared' this video (not an incident itself really) to any other incident. It is a fact though, that as a result of the Marcus Groh incident, the safety of this type of diving has been called into question, and specifically the safety procedures of an operator many of us support have been questioned to the extent that the operation's viability could have been affected.

I think it is fair to observe that shark diving as done from another boat, at least in this video, is being conducted in a somewhat disorganized fashion, that many would consider less safe. This video could be used by those who wish to terminate this activity as an example of these supposedly unsafe practices. It is also ironic that the owner of this boat was involved in questioning the unsafe practices of his competition.

Whether or not anyone thinks their antics are amusing or not is of course up to the personal taste of the viewer.

Jeff et al

I think much of the 'disorganization' is attributed to the way Bruno edited his video (which on reflection was kinda well done). Although I've only watched it once with paying too much attention to detail, most of the karate stuff was not around the the main baiting area but cleverly cut to appear so. The main baiting scenes were fairly normal for such dives. The pole throwing was probably thrown to 'appear' it was aimed at the shark but it fell quite short of the target and actually behind the shark. It's a camera angle trick much akin to how Harrison Ford throws his punches in Indiana Jones. Bravo to Bruno for managing to "sell" that shot (as the industry would say) to so many people that it invokes such reactions.

Let's also keep in mind that Bruno put up the video to share his fun, not be crucified for not appealing to everyone's sensibilities. Let's give him the respect to start another thread about the objectionable actions of the operators, since Bruno is not one of them.

If there is going to be a debate over the different operators and the politics of shark diving in the Bahamas (which is getting far away from the purpose of the video), let's do it logically and with facts and not gut reactions and unsubstantiated assumptions, as I see how a few people have reacted to the video.

Is it just me or did anyone think the music actually didn't go very well with most of the film... Ok its a take on the location and the divers banged their heads to the main up tempo parts (Wayne's worldesque) but it, to me, just didn't gel...

Apart from that, nicely put together and some lovely sequences.. I guessed the stick throwing incident was a camera angle trick but if it wasn't then.. shame on that man and I hope the shark sues the idiot next time.. or worse I didn't like the sharks being dragged out the water for their amusement but if sharky did'nt like it I guess it would have let go...Just me being the softy I am.. I loved the Wushu display how many of us did that when we were younger in the swimming pools.. But if they want to be 'brave' trying it on the sharks or just do it for the cameras then I hope they never lose a hand or arm as it would be detrimental to the shark, with bad press and thats a terrible thing.. Please think before you act for both your sakes...

I cannot wait for the 'part 2' when they try the same in Africa in the middle of a pride of lions... .. as my mate Paul weller would say "Now thats entertainment"...

Dive safe

DeanB

This is a forum and the movie, however inane to some, is funny to others. For those who have issues with the safety and disrespect for sea life, write to the BDA and the operators. Why put someone on the spot for thinking it's funny because you are appalled by it?

I guess I didn't understand the rules of your forum.

Sorry for spoiling everyone's fun.

Later.

most of the karate stuff was not around the the main baiting area but cleverly cut to appear so.

If you look closely you see the 'No Tigers Allowed' sign in one of the frames

Personally I dont care about the video itself, only about the reactions it can bring from people with even worse sensibilities than the divers here.

Cor

Let's also keep in mind that Bruno put up the video to share his fun, not be crucified for not appealing to everyone's sensibilities. Let's give him the respect to start another thread about the objectionable actions of the operators, since Bruno is not one of them.

It is not solely a question of intent. People could find videos of enlarged puffers being carried by divers as fun, people skinning sharks fun, people dancing on reefs fun and just post them to share the fun. Those are rather extreme examples and would probably offend everyone's sensibilites here, but as you can see from responses in this thread there was enough in the video to approach a line in many people's minds.

Unless the operators were the only ones doing these things, the diver's actions have opened them up to discussion. Though there is the issue that the operators appeared to have let these things happen without any intervention, I am not sure that participating, whether filming or otherwise, should not be mentioned in discussing the video. It happens all the time when people post pictures or other items (was there too much Photoshop, was the animal harrassed, etc.)

I agree that assumptions are being made to some degree. Though it seems like certain things occurred, in fact this may have taken place in a couple of moments and the operator may have stopped the divers immediately, gave them a lecture and made them sit out dives, and the divers may have not realized that their actions could be off.

I guess I didn't understand the rules of your forum.

 

Sorry for spoiling everyone's fun.

 

Later.

Jeremy - I don't think Drew is talking about the "rules" of the forum. He's just saying that people can think the video is funny, and that's fine. As long as there is mutual respect, everything is fine here.

Not a fun thing.. but we all have different opinions on things.. Obviously.. I was talking to a bloke in a pub not long ago who agreed with the seal culls in Canada.. Because he said that they were depleting fish stocks and people were losing their jobs.. Well.. I had to walk away.. or he would have lost his teeth..

But this is what forums are for in a way, to put your views forward and let off steam etc..etc.. If we start censoring things then its a steep slope downhill.. in my opinion...

Dive safe

DeanB

Jeremy - I don't think Drew is talking about the "rules" of the forum. He's just saying that people can think the video is funny, and that's fine. As long as there is mutual respect, everything is fine here.

Gotcha ... in re-reading Drew's post I see that I misread it slightly. You CAN think its funny ... and, as I said, you've been on dives like this (and I haven't) and you have a much better sense of what's safe and what's not.

[sorry, I'm kinda grumpy today ... I have my entire digital life - hundreds of GBs of music, video and photos - stored on a RAID-based NAS and backed up on an external USB drive ...

Long story short, yesterday I re-formatted the external drive to create a band-new full backup and, of course, the NAS died mid-backup. Hopefully it is just a faulty power-supply and there was no data loss, but I won't know until Wednesday when the new PSU arrives.

The only good news is that the backup that did run successfully was my photos ...]

I agree that assumptions are being made to some degree.

Yes there were. On my first viewing, I saw differences in water turbidity, color and depth between the scenes of the baited shark dives and the kung fu stuff. That alone suggested to me the scenes were separately shot. On my just 2nd viewing, I see only 2 scenes where close proximity interaction with lemon sharks where the kungfu stuff was going on. Were these done on the baited dives where the big tigers were around or were the lemon sharks just around while the guys were out having fun? Can anyone tell? I surely can not. I can say with more certainty that the lemon shark behavior of swimming around divers etc is a result of constant bait/feeding interaction. And yes, falling onto the shark wasn't nice but it's quite obvious he didn't see the shark coming behind his leg and it knocked him over.

To me, the kungfu/headbanging stuff is just a bunch of guys having a good time on holiday. The editing and separate scenes made it look chaotic for effect. I ,for one, can see the pole was thrown BEHIND the shark and not with much force, hence to me it was just another effect shot. I'm sure it doesn't appeal to everyone and everyone has a right to voice that opinion. However, let's not accuse the guy of viciously trying to impale a lemon shark with a hollow pole for a shot.

Furthermore, calling the divers "spastic" and "stupid" etc. doesn't show much respect for fellow divers out on holiday and probably not harming anything or anyone. Then the assumption the operator condones this sort of behavior on baited dives without any solid proof is neither fair or even logical. The editing made it look like the operator allows their customers to go nuts, whereas further scrutiny on the baited dive scenes show it to be atypical of such dives. The Bahamian shark diving operators' turf war has been pushed on to this thread. If this were the operator's official video, then it would be fine. But it's not and I think it fair to move such a discussion to another thread if it needs further analysis.

But this is what forums are for in a way, to put your views forward and let off steam etc..etc.. If we start censoring things then its a steep slope downhill.. in my opinion...

Nothing has been censored. I simply asked people to calm down and examine things logically. It's not nice to unleash on other people's work because you don't feel very congenial. You want to rant, start your own thread. That is what Eric means when he says mutual respect.

Maybe I am just getting old, and maybe, if I were still 18 I would have done the same thing...however, I am not. I only found the video boring, not very well filmed and uninventive. What I do enjoy are the honest debates, disagreements and different perspectives....I also enjoy the lack of flames and disrespect which is the norm here and why this has been such a decent community here. Time to lighten up folk

Steve B)

I went through a few different feelings while watching this. First of all, I was like - yeah good editing - then - what the hell are they doing - though hey they were indeed fun diving! Then I couldn't stop giggling at the way they were acting, if you don't see the funny side in some of it, how unfortunate for you! Yeah, I agree very jackass style, then I went on to think hey, isn't this area meant to be no direct feeding? Then - oh no now their loosing it, there was no need to throw a pole at a shark, yeah for sure break your buddies camera, but don't hurt the shark. I think the kids got a wee bit carried away there, as kids and boys do...

Nothing has been censored. I simply asked people to calm down and examine things logically. It's not nice to unleash on other people's work because you don't feel very congenial. You want to rant, start your own thread. That is what Eric means when he says mutual respect.

Didn't say it had been... Just saying 'if' we do start because of different opinions and objections then its a bad thing...And who's ranting ??? Not me ..

Dive safe

DeanB

ooops what happend here??? i did't not cheked the forum a few days and everbody is talking and judging me

I will try to give more info on the video and the trip aboard the Dolphin Dream.

First like some people noticed, offcourse all the shots of people doing crazy are filmed whitout having bait / tiger sharks around, the fact that some people do not see that means my movie works

I organised a 9 days trip on the Dolphin Dream whit all friends of me (yep most of them are allitle crazy) , 2 days we played whit the dolphins and the rest we spend on diving with sharks and trying to get the tigers sharks around the boat!

Offcourse the tigers are not always around so we had allot of time watching the Lemons sharks that are always in big numbers around.

Like sombody noticed the lemons realy are not intrested in divers or whatever they are just swimming around, and waiting to get a nice fish now and then.

The crew of the Dolphin Dream was realy good about informing uss about the safty etc of diving with sharks, my trip was 1 month afther the accident on Jim's boat offcourse whe alle where very intrested about the facts how somhting like this happens and i can tell you nobody on board told somthing bad about Jim's boat or whatever! The only fact so far i now till now, and i suppose all of you is that the accident happend in deeper whater and far away (200km?) of Tiger Beach and it was whit a Bull shark!

So to repead myself all the crazy shots are filmed away from the bait etc, you will see only a few lemon sharks wondering around not in the bigg numbers like we have when baiting them!

Then about the stick incident, first if you watch closse enough or see it in good quality (youtube sucks) you will see the stick is more then a meter away from the shark, and it was never the intention to trow to the shark!

You will think why trow with sticks then? well i will tell you allitle about the film i am making on the moment!

After difrent kind of documentarys whit diffrent succes i was thinking to do somthing funny, so i had the idee to make a funny underwaterolympics story! All the shots specialy filmed for that are not in the youtube film!

1 of the diciplines is spear trowing! so thats how i have the shot of the stick flying close to a shark what is never been the intention, i hope to finish the olympics movie this summer so you all can judge that :-)

Looking forward to more Judging

Greetings Bruno

P.S. sorry about my english i do my best

Hi Bruno,

I guess an apology is in order. But I would make one comment; I am not a video guy, so when I watch a video or movie I do not tend to take it apart and analyze how the pieces are put together. For me, and I think for most people who are not videographers, a video or movie is seen as one continuous narrative.

So I went back and watched it again, and yes, I can see how the video was shot as you explained. But....when I put it all back together as a single narrative, my original impression remains.

Hi Bruno,

I guess an apology is in order.

I do not make a apology! and i do not see a reason to do that! i like to be cristal clear about that!

The only thing maybe wrong in the film is the diver falling on the lemon shark but like you can see that is by accident and the shark do not have eny problem with it so do not make it worser then necesary!

Bruno

Bruno

Jeff is apologizing to you and not asking for an apology.

And all this could've been avoided if you added the famous lines that all movies add waaayyyy at the end of the credits:

"No animals have been ill-treated, injured or killed in the making of this film."

But then again, it's at the end of the credits so no one really reads it.

If you really want to make it difficult for people to tell the cuts apart, color correct to match the water color between the scenes. Even in Youtube quality I can see the differences and I wasn't looking for it. Oh and for effect, you should give the poles that light saber effect. It's easily done on Adobe AEFX.

loved the headbanging part...