Flooded GATES EX1 housing

A wrench is what happens to your guts when you watch a sad or scary film isn't it?

A wrench is what happens to your guts when you watch a sad or scary film isn't it?

So what happened to spanners!!!

While they might have a great reputation, I think if I were in the video market right now I'd have to consider someone else.

And if they made housings for still cameras or strobes or anything related to underwater imaging I would consider them and no one else based on every experience I have had with them. They really go out of the way to help customers, at least upon my experience. The reason I chose Gates is because I learned on that and a couple of other brands. A DM told me that they did have one issue with a Gates Housing, the DM sent it in and Gates replaced the camera for them when Gates said it looked like there was a bad housing (this was awhile ago.) Since then I have had a couple of them, and Pam, John and the rest of Gates go way above and beyond - at least they have for me. YMMV.

All that white crud would suggest lack of cleansing post dive, which if i were Gates would suggest lack of maintenance.

 

Stew

The housing is cleaned like crazy, even after the flood!

The "whit crud" is just dust or somthing it went in a box to GATES and back!

And Gates made a report (that you can read in the 1st posting) and did't not say enything about lack of maintenance!

I have no idee how much more i can clean the housing! i clean it after every dive and after every trip i put it in a bad with water where i gife it a nice treat like a baby!

ENOUGH OF THIS DENIAL RUBBISH.

Get over it - you have had a partial

Now get ready for your next one - hope and pray it's as minor as this one.

If your really bothered about the possibilities you could always install ( and use ) a Gates Seal Check

or even safer leave your camera and housing the boat.

Doesn't matter how you look at it, or the excuses you make the user is always responsible for ensuring the equipment is waterproof and ready to dive with.

Ok people,

Disagree with Bruno but please keep it civil. We at Wetpixel encourage everyone to write about their issues and discover what went wrong.

While I do think this issue must be resolved between Gates and Bruno, the fact is Bruno brought information that may help prevent a flood in other people's rigs.

So please keep your comments civil.

ENOUGH OF THIS DENIAL RUBBISH.

 

Get over it - you have had a partial

Now get ready for your next one - hope and pray it's as minor as this one.

 

If your really bothered about the possibilities you could always install ( and use ) a Gates Seal Check

or even safer leave your camera and housing the boat.

 

Doesn't matter how you look at it, or the excuses you make the user is always responsible for ensuring the equipment is waterproof and ready to dive with.

DENIAL RUBBISH!?!?

I had a flood beginning of this year my Z1 flooded in my Light and Motion housing!

There was only one guy responsible and that was me!!! i was and still am angry like crazy after 3,5 years using that housing and camera, to do a stupid mistake with that result (camera dead and also electronica from LMI dead) i never looked for ecxuses i just banged my head to the wall :-)

And now this happens to me les then 6 months later, i do not believe this is my fault this time, and that is what i am asking here, is it to much to try to be politely?

And some people are agree with me there is somthing wrong! do you always react like this when people are not agree with what you are thinking?

This is a forum and that is where people have discussions with diffrent opinions if you have problems with that do not read forums and go diving instead :-)

Yes, of course, we all need to keep things civil. Mr. Mooney was just being overly enthusiastic with his disagreement.

I do have a question regarding the Gates housings. Are there things on or in the housing that should be checked but can not be? If so, than that would raise legit questions regarding responsibility and QS.

Steve

Greetings to all,

I just returned from vacation to this post and have some comments that may be helpful.

· Despite the unfortunate circumstance of Bruno’s flood, we remain committed his success with the EX1 housing. Our findings on this matter have already been posted, so I will comment no further in this forum. His housing has been inspected, repaired, tested, cleaned and returned to him – all at no cost.

· As highlighted by several members, conventional use of underwater equipment includes inspections and checks. To this extent Gates user manuals (Setup, Use and Care Guide and Housing Care and Maintenance Guide) cover the importance of such pre-dive measures.

· Ideally it should be unnecessary to perform a gland check, but clearly other factors outside our control remain. For example, the increasing rate of damage incurred by security and customs make such pre-use inspections ever more important (TSA is responsible for more than $10K damage to our own equipment). Practically speaking, then, it would be wise to perform a gland check upon reaching your destination and prior to diving. We will add this to our user manuals.

· A Gland Check is straightforward: lightly attempt to turn them with your fingers. If you cannot, go no further. If the gland is obviously loose, tightening them is appropriate, and will not void your warranty – if performed properly. Excessive torque or improper tools can cause damage, so contact Gates for guidance. As always, support is available by phone or email.

John

Thanks for the understanding - please don't mistake my empathy for your situation vs the reality.

Reality is that this piece of equipment went into the water and shortly thereafter had a moisture issue.

Empathy say's my pocket book and budget's feel for you.

At the end of the day it has little to do with the housing company and a lot to do with the user.

· As highlighted by several members, conventional use of underwater equipment includes inspections and checks. To this extent Gates user manuals (Setup, Use and Care Guide and Housing Care and Maintenance Guide) cover the importance of such pre-dive measures.

 

· Ideally it should be unnecessary to perform a gland check, but clearly other factors outside our control remain. For example, the increasing rate of damage incurred by security and customs make such pre-use inspections ever more important (TSA is responsible for more than $10K damage to our own equipment). Practically speaking, then, it would be wise to perform a gland check upon reaching your destination and prior to diving. We will add this to our user manuals.

 

· A Gland Check is straightforward: lightly attempt to turn them with your fingers. If you cannot, go no further. If the gland is obviously loose, tightening them is appropriate, and will not void your warranty – if performed properly. Excessive torque or improper tools can cause damage, so contact Gates for guidance. As always, support is available by phone or email.

 

John

John

Thanks for chiming in. Please drop a link for the updated PDF user manual when it's done.

Unfortunately some users are uncomfortable/unwilling to do these things themselves and also usually will not have the proper tools to do them. Can Gates provide a tool (wrench/spanner) for the glands or at least give the tool size in the updated manual?

I understand it is difficult to ascertain the cause of the loosening of the glands. Out of curiosity and if it's not confidential, how often does that happen (as in how many customers complain about loose glands )?

I understand it is difficult to ascertain the cause of the loosening of the glands. Out of curiosity and if it's not confidential, how often does that happen (as in how many customers complain about loose glands )?

Drew, do you really expect Gates to give you an honest answer? If there was many complaining customers, it would give Bruno ammunition and put Gates on the grill.

After reading all this, my conclusion is that the Gates EX1 housing has unreliable parts and is very high maintenance. Not for me.

Pierre

Pierre, that is your perogative to choose where you want to spend your money.

All I can say is I've dealt with John on a professional level and have found him to be more than forthright when it comes to this sort of thing. I'm not expecting him to publicly disclose confidential information but then again Gates has issued service announcements before regarding several issues on the EX1 housing. They could've done it quietly but they chose to announce on WP for no other reason than to reach as many customers as quickly as possible.

I, for one, give Gate the benefit of the doubt when it comes to this sort of thing, where there is no clear cut evidence.

We have to realize housings are precision instruments, and with any precision instrument put in harsh environments like airline cargo holds, boats etc, there is a possibility of things going bad. The more precise the instrument, the higher likelihood of high maintenance. This is not a small consumer camcorder with 3 functions. And fyi, one manufacturer (not Gates) which has "fuss free" plug and play failed on me so many times, I complained to the manufacturer, only to be told I was using it too often?!?

This particular issue is about the product/manufacturer's initial quality release and subsequent user maintenance. It'd be pretty unrealistic to think that Gates would be able to anticipate every problem that can occur and put a warning in the manual, which would then be so thick I'd scream about fallen trees. And how many actually read past how to operate the housing? Especially experienced shooters who think they know how to take care of housings?

It's also fair to assume that the housing when delivered to the user works according to specs, which in the case of Bruno meant 50+ dives over several months and different destinations . From my own personal experience, hand carrying the housing doesn't necessarily protect the housing from damage, even in first class.

I think John admits that checking the glands is now part of prep work and will add an addendum to the manuals. I do dislike making assumptions with no data on either side. I trust both sides are telling the truth (neither have a reason to lie), but I didn't see the housing or how Bruno preps it. Nor did I inspect the housing after the flood and what Gates actually fixed. Why jump to conclusions on minimal data?

I do hope people realize the bigger cameras require more maintenance. Obviously, the manufacturers are not absolved from their responsibility to produce working housings. Let's not judge either side without proper information.

For me, I've learnt to check the housing glands more often. And I have Bruno to thank for that and I think Gates should thank him too for bringing an important maintenance essential to their attention.

Drew,

We're only human and draw conclusions based on the facts given. I read above "For example, the increasing rate of damage incurred by security and customs make such pre-use inspections ever more important (TSA is responsible for more than $10K damage to our own equipment)." It is pretty easy to blame the 3rd party which no one cares for anyway. I think this is a little bit of a cop-out. If the item was damaged during transit wouldn't that be evident? From what I've read from Bruno's and Gate's account leads me to think the gland worked its way free after normal use or after vibrations due to transit. In either case, isn't this unacceptable for a part of a case not designed for regular (pre-dive check type of) maintenance? I get a little tired of people always jumping to the defense of the manufacturer in these cases. If we just throw our hands in the air and say everything that goes in the water is going to get wet then we will continue to get the type of equipment that will fulfill our expectations. On Gate's part I'm happy to see they came on here to addres the issue and that they're adding a blurb to the manual This at least shows a willingness to prevent future failures and a commitment to address issues rather than dodge them.

For me, I've learnt to check the housing glands more often. And I have Bruno to thank for that and I think Gates should thank him too for bringing an important maintenance essential to their attention.

Yeah! But at what cost for Bruno (not Gates)?

Pierre

Pierre

I think it's very unrealistic to think there is no risk to your camera flooding. There is a risk EVERY TIME you enter the water, be it incompetence from the user or faulty housing.

So far, Bruno is the only person to bring up the loose gland issue, whilst others have given examples of equipment failures on a larger scale before manufacturers even think of compensation. I love to hear anecdotal evidence of housing manufacturers replacing cameras etc, but those circumstances are not the same. I know of at least 4 other Gates EX1 users who haven't yet had a problem like that. If there were a major issue, I think it would surface rather quickly. Or maybe it has and it's been dealt with privately. Without details, I won't speculate.

I'm very empathetic and sympathetic to Bruno's plight. Nobody likes to lose a camera. I'm sure it doesn't console Bruno at all however I feel. In fact, irregardless of however anyone feels, the camera is still toast.

Hopefully others will see that equipment insurance is important. It's part of being a pro.

And I believe that Gates shouldn't be held unaccountable IF there was an assembling issue. My point is that there is not enough evidence to make any kind of conclusion. It's easy to jump in and judge. I won't be as quick to judge without further information which will never surface.

I could be mistaken, but the glands on the EX1 housing look to be same as on my FX7 housing which look the same as many other Gates housings. If the glands were a major issue I think the problems would appear on other Gates housings and it would be pretty hard for word not to get around. This is the 1st I've heard of a Gates gland problem.

I could be mistaken, but the glands on the EX1 housing look to be same as on my FX7 housing which look the same as many other Gates housings. If the glands were a major issue I think the problems would appear on other Gates housings and it would be pretty hard for word not to get around. This is the 1st I've heard of a Gates gland problem.

Me too, but I had a similar problem with an Ikelite housing, the gland became loose after a long drive.

After reading all this, my conclusion is that the Gates EX1 housing has unreliable parts and is very high maintenance. Not for me.

 

Pierre

Right. So by this logic you would also suggest that all cars are unreliable as they have parts prone to failure therefore leading to high maintenance costs which is why you walk everywhere?

It's also fair to assume that the housing when delivered to the user works according to specs, which in the case of Bruno meant 50+ dives over several months and different destinations.

Drew has hit the proverbial nail squarely on the head here - the fundamental problem is that after 50+ dives (where the have gland must have operated fine), something changed! And whatever it was, it resulted in the gland being loose and the flood. Given that Gates use loctite and that they state that the traces were still there when they received the housing back, then its unlikely that it undid itself - if it did who would you blame, Gates for using loctite or loctite because their product failed to work as it should? Sadly the bottom line is that the gland came undone for reasons still unknown, that this wasn't picked up by Brumpy unfortunately and the end result was a flood. Sad, annoying, costly but attributing blame to a manufacturer whose product has worked fine for 50+ dives is only feasible if there is clear evidence of a design or assembly fault and from what I've read here that simply doesn't appear to be the case.

Commiserations Brumpy, but I'm afraid you'll simply have to live with it and move on ..... nothing else to be said really.