Britain's Secret Seas : Sunday 8pm BBC2/BBC HD Channel

Episode 1 sounds like my last summer diving in the UK - basking sharks and spider crabs...

I don't know if it was a tight shooting schedule, but the spider crab sequence was a bit... ho, hum... underwhelming. I enjoyed it, though, which I wasn't expecting, being a curmudgeonly and hyper-critical sort at the best of times.

Tim

Uurrghh! There was a horrible purple cast on my HD-TV screen, making me think: "filter!"...

And ambient WB and then switching on the lights would do the same (not seen the footage). If so would be a schoolboy error.

As a UK dive photographer I'd like to see one day more of a David Attenborough style wildlife programme, there is certainly scope for that when considering a new series, and I think that is what many people in our UW photo community were expecting.

Springwatch are working on a Best of Britain underwater (albeit with a spring vibe). One to watch out for.

Alex

By strange coincidence, I was just visiting my printer and he was watching and enjoying an episode on SkyPlus. The spider crab bit was on and I thought it was good fun. Pity they went at the wrong time of year - Doh!

I spent one morning looking for spider crabs aggregations last year and saw 1000s of them in England. But then I did some RESEARCH before I went!

That said - I thought it was still a decent sequence and the girl presenting it (Toomi?) did a really good job. So I have seen 5 mins and so far, it is alright! I am with Louie!

Alex

I hate to be overly critical of others work, but I'm personally very sad that this appears to be the best that the BBC can offer when there are SO many talented underwater camera operators and film makers out there just itching to get an opportunity to do something with that kind of budget. I thought after the utterly dire Oceans and Pacific Abyss series that they'd think again about how and what they are doing, but alas no. Is this honestly the best we can do?? Very, very sad indeed.

with that kind of budget.

You seem to be making the assumption that, as a BBC production, the series had a bottomless pit of money to dip into. Sadly those days are gone, even Auntie Beeb has had to pull her belt in a couple of notches.

Costs of a dive team are high, getting all the appropriate people together (director, presenter, cameraman, supervisor, standby divers, boatman and the boat and equipment) is tricky enough, let alone when conditions are ideal. Its a far cry from just getting in and shooting at will and becoming extremely expensive especially relative to above water shooting. If you are lucky you might (might) get 2 hours underwater in a day IME, often less. And everone is under (perhaps unspoken) pressure to produce something usable. TV work is hard and can be extremely frustrating (I had a recent shoot where the weather turned and we had to relocate to a less than ideal location, but the presenter is busy so it was shoot something rather than try to reschedule). Sometimes its possible to shoot really interesting footage, but often its the story footage which comes first and this has got to be 'in the bag'. Bottlefish will no doubt confirm!

Costs of a dive team are high, getting all the appropriate people together (director, presenter, cameraman, supervisor, standby divers, boatman and the boat and equipment) is tricky enough, let alone when conditions are ideal. Its a far cry from just getting in and shooting at will and becoming extremely expensive especially relative to above water shooting. If you are lucky you might (might) get 2 hours underwater in a day IME, often less. And everone is under (perhaps unspoken) pressure to produce something usable. TV work is hard and can be extremely frustrating (I had a recent shoot where the weather turned and we had to relocate to a less than ideal location, but the presenter is busy so it was shoot something rather than try to reschedule). Sometimes its possible to shoot really interesting footage, but often its the story footage which comes first and this has got to be 'in the bag'. Bottlefish will no doubt confirm!

I couldn't have put it better myself, thanks Paul. It's easy to forget that the footage needs to fit the story, not the other way around, and that, in turn, the story and end production needs to fit the intended audience.

... the footage needs to fit the story...

I can see that, and I enjoyed the second part, but I got the feeling that the story was strongly influenced by what was filmable: most of us would choose the Hispania over the Breda on most days, for instance! Cathedral rock wasn't at its best, and both the plumose anemones and dead-mens' fingers to the north, off the headland, are rather more impressive, if deeper.

Cathedral rock:

Wuddy rocks:

Tim

Cathedral rock:

 

 

 

 

Wuddy rocks:

 

 

 

 

Tim

 

I think both look pretty stunning Tim, nice photos

You seem to be making the assumption that, as a BBC production, the series had a bottomless pit of money to dip into. Sadly those days are gone, even Auntie Beeb has had to pull her belt in a couple of notches.

No I'm not making that assumption at all. I'm fully aware that budgets are getting squeezed which makes it even more important why money should not be wasted. I'd be shocked if the budget for this series was anything less than £60,000 an episode and I'm being very generous with that because given its time slot it would indicate that the budget was many times this. I wasn't even implying that the poor quality of the series was down to a lack of money, just that others would go to heaven to work with those resources at their disposal.

Look this is not a personal attack so please don't take it as such, but facts are facts. This series certainly appears to be a massive wasted opportunity and follows on from a number of huge recent disappointments already mentioned. Take personal emotions and egos out of the equation and I doubt that anyone could really argue with that.

Cheers, Simon

You seem to be making the assumption that, as a BBC production, the series had a bottomless pit of money to dip into. Sadly those days are gone, even Auntie Beeb has had to pull her belt in a couple of notches.

Stu are you a producer that quote sounded like it was straight from the school of broadcast producers...

Dive safe

DeanB

This series certainly appears to be a massive wasted opportunity and follows on from a number of huge recent disappointments already mentioned.

I was fully prepared to dislike the series: I think it's actually been rather good so far! Perhaps it's the conservation focus, perhaps I'm not so upset by the magazine format, but I think that it's considerably more engaging than this team's previous series. As I've said, I think that the underwater images might reflect a pretty tight deadline for getting the sequences, so that the conditions were those available and not, as seen in the flagship Natural History Unit productions, the very best achieved after diligent searching and great patience.

Tim

No I'm not making that assumption at all. I'm fully aware that budgets are getting squeezed which makes it even more important why money should not be wasted. I'd be shocked if the budget for this series was anything less than £60,000 an episode and I'm being very generous with that because given its time slot it would indicate that the budget was many times this. I wasn't even implying that the poor quality of the series was down to a lack of money, just that others would go to heaven to work with those resources at their disposal.

Whilst I'm not aware of the exact figure, I'm pretty sure you'd be shocked... and don't stress, I wasn't trying to imply any implication, just pointing out your assumption on the budget is perhaps a tad misguided

Look this is not a personal attack so please don't take it as such, but facts are facts. This series certainly appears to be a massive wasted opportunity and follows on from a number of huge recent disappointments already mentioned. Take personal emotions and egos out of the equation and I doubt that anyone could really argue with that.

 

Cheers, Simon

But you're not quoting facts Simon, you're throwing in personal opinions, thankfully not everyone agrees with you (although again, please don't worry yourself, my emotions aren't phased and my ego hasn't been dented ).

Stu are you a producer that quote sounded like it was straight from the school of broadcast producers...

 

Dive safe

 

DeanB

absolutely not!! I'm just a lowly cameraman, assistant camera on this particular production (hence trying to keep my replies limited to the facts, understand that any opinions I have are not entirely objective ).... trust me, we're all feeling the pinch though.

absolutely not!! I'm just a lowly cameraman, assistant camera.

Assistant??? So the budget was pretty good then, most shoots i've been on cannot afford such positions... Unless you are good friends with Scott or Gavin??? Assistants these days are very few if non existent.

So!! Who was to blame for the 'wobbly' camera work in some parts ???

Dive safe

DeanB

So!! Who was to blame for the 'wobbly' camera work in some parts ???

 

Dive safe

 

DeanB

I think I'd best retreat back into my quiet corner

Whilst I'm not aware of the exact figure, I'm pretty sure you'd be shocked... and don't stress, I wasn't trying to imply any implication, just pointing out your assumption on the budget is perhaps a tad misguided

 

But you're not quoting facts Simon, you're throwing in personal opinions, thankfully not everyone agrees with you (although again, please don't worry yourself, my emotions aren't phased and my ego hasn't been dented ).

Of course I'm throwing in personal opinions, this is an internet discussion forum after all. But if you want to talk facts then by all means tell us the budget so we can all gauge whether it was money well spent.......

I genuinely didn't want to start an argument here, but if you honestly want to stand behind this series as a great piece of work and a great use of budget then I'm bemused. Yes it is better than the previous two series mentioned, but it's not much better (in my opinion). Why (in my opinion) it is lacking is up for debate. The camera work is good apart from that stunt with the underwater camera mask (in my opinion) and the subject matter is amazing (in everyone's opinion hopefully), yet this is what has been produced. Hmmmmmm

The camera work is good apart from that stunt with the underwater camera mask (in my opinion) and the subject matter is amazing (in everyone's opinion hopefully), yet this is what has been produced. Hmmmmmm

12 minutes at the Farnes and about two minutes' worth of footage of seals .... why did we need a free diver when we could just have admired the seals? And I'm really not enjoying the presentational style. Wish they were heard and not seen ... and here comes the bit about how worried the dive supervisor is. Arghh!

Ah - the second segment at the Farnes much better.

12 minutes at the Farnes and about two minutes' worth of footage of seals .... why did we need a free diver when we could just have admired the seals? And I'm really not enjoying the presentational style. Wish they were heard and not seen ... and here comes the bit about how worried the dive supervisor is. Arghh!

Hi Elaine ... Sometimes presenters can actually 'make' the programme although I have to agree on this series it was a struggle, I do like Paul Rose and I think he should have done the lot... The 'worried' supervisor, on most occasions, is for the general public to add a bit of tension divers can spot this a mile off... Richard Bull is a top bloke and awesome at his job, it's usually the programme that dictates the tension and, I expect, to Mr Bulls amusement

I think I'd best retreat back into my quiet corner

Or maybe Less use of the BBC credit card the night before

Dive safe

DeanB

Hi, Dean! I know what you're saying .... it's just so frustrating.

Or maybe Less use of the BBC credit card the night before

If only!