Panasonic GH4 might get a V-log profile?

Check out this article:

http://www.backscatter.com/learn/article/article.php?ID=201

This is what stand out and seems to happened to me that the water was a bit purple when I test dive with the GH4:

"Unfortunately, the Panasonic GH4 does not like to take an ambient light white balance without a color filter installed on the lens. Without a filter, I could not get an accurate white balance at even moderate depths. I got mixed results at 30 feet and at 40 feet the water would turn purple and the entire image would appear flat"

May be those who have white balance off from time to time should give color filter a try again?

This is exactly what I have experienced however once you have a filter there is no benefit whatsoever performing custom white balance auto works just fine. The issue is that when you shoot a rectilinear lens you need to stop down this together with one light stop loss of the filter means you are shooting high ISO. For this reason I think wet lenses are the way to go despite all the theory as they work fine at wider apertures. We shall see

Interesting they mention the Magic Filters. Gee. Really itchy to get some clear / bright days here to try out mine!! Ordered both the Blue and Green Versions as I'm not sure for our local waters (Mediterranean)

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This is exactly what I have experienced however once you have a filter there is no benefit whatsoever performing custom white balance auto works just fine.

Not might experience at all. To qualify that, I'm talking about when doing ambient light shots (even with fill light) - which is really the only reason you need the red filter. AWB, even with filters, is hit or miss on every camera I've filmed with. There are techniques, such as turning the camera on while pointing at sand, that can produce fairly decent results, but it's still a crap shoot IMO. Those techniques worked for my old PC100, and I've used it for the GoPro, but for camera's where I can MWB I will go that route every time (even if I have to do it for every shot) - even with a filter.

From my experience, the best result is filter + MWB. I used the Magic filter back when I have my Sanyo camcorder and get the most gorgeous blue at Red Sea. The idea behind the MWB is to get the subject properly white balance while the Magic Filter "restore" the blue at the background.

You shouldn't really just put on a red filter and set it to AWB, because red filter only work down to 30 or 40 feet or so. Why else all the goPro flip filter need 3 different shade of red? There is no one red filter that work on a depth so MWB is still required.

Here is some explanation of Magic filter, and at the bottom it explain filter + MWB.

http://www.uwphotographyguide.com/underwater-photography-filters

 

You shouldn't really just put on a red filter and set it to AWB, because red filter only work down to 30 or 40 feet or so. Why else all the goPro flip filter need 3 different shade of red? There is no one red filter that work on a depth so MWB is still required.

 

Here is some explanation of Magic filter, and at the bottom it explain filter + MWB.

 

http://www.uwphotographyguide.com/underwater-photography-filters

That's theory and actually pretty incorrect couple of videos with auto white balance

And another

The practical demonstration that custom white balance at all costs does not produce best results is actually in an ikelite promo video

You can see that custom white balance actually has the wrong hues

There are two parts to the white balance issue:

1. The camera doesn't just get it right

2. The water effect in terms of temperature and tint

Scubabob example is 1 above you need to start the footage with something in the frame so that the camera gets it right. Similar issue to go pro

The second case does not require custom white balance with a red filter unless you are really deep and want to try with the filter (most times results are crap regardless)

A blue water filter is usually just a mired shift with a bit of tint the net effect is to bring the camera within the range auto white balance works (up to 7000K) the shift is around 3000K. So when the color temperature goes above say 9000K your filter brings it back in range. When it is really super cool at 10000K even with the filter you are out of range so in theory you need to white balance however this usually occurs at depth where the extra stop of the filter produces footage so grainy that you tend to use a setting with 9900K and Max out the tint although most times is better to shoot black and white

If the camera is capable of finding a good white balance and the mechanism doesn't get fooled whe in water there is no benefit to use custom white balance unless the camera itself has an issue

I balance all cameras on land and then compare the difference with a shot in auto white balance most times the temperature is correct but the tint is marginally off so I set white balance to auto and shift the tint a bit to compensate. The malta video has yellow increased to +1 in auto as the sony like to push too deep blues

As always it is a personal and creative choice but I never use red filters underwater.

Red filter only have any benefit in certain situations and they add a bunch of complications to an already complex process. Too shallow and they make the footage too red. Too deep and they remove too much light (remember that the filter removes blue and green but does not add red). If you leave it on in the wrong light situation, you will have some difficult footage to grade. Even if you do get the on-off timing right, the footage either side of the transition is difficult to color match. If you pan up, all the highlights will have a red tinge.

And why bother with that complication when the GH4 has a more viable solution: the 4 WB presets. Fill these up BEFORE you go diving and flip between them, depending on the ambient light color. I wrote an earlier post on how to do this. Just take a WB setting off four pieces of coloured paper in sunlight, save them in the presets and remember which preset is for which lighting condition. Save that with your other favorite settings in a Custom Setting so you can get back to them quickly if you ever decided to play with MWB while diving. I keep it simple: 1. shallow to mid tropical blue water, 2. mid to deep tropical blue water, 3. shallow to mid greenish water and 4. mid to deep greenish water. These get you very close to a good WB that can be tweaked in the edit. And it doesn't rob you of an f-stop or two.

Regards

Peter

Can these 4 WB Presents be individual per each Custom Setting? or are they shared (no matter which mode you're in) ?

I think my problem (locally) is that my dive sites are all sub 20m, so probably the filters will be no good...

It is true that filters can lead to some complications especially if they are not removable. However whilst I like Peter footage very much in terms of sharpness, composition the colours don't do it for me. The theory is all good but is the outcome that matters. If you are happy with those colours fine otherwise a filter is a good option especially down to 20-25 depending on conditions. I have found that newer camera can white balance even at shallow depth without any major problems the only time where the filter is deadly is if you shoot backlit or in the sun

From my experience, the best result is filter + MWB. I used the Magic filter back when I have my Sanyo camcorder and get the most gorgeous blue at Red Sea. The idea behind the MWB is to get the subject properly white balance while the Magic Filter "restore" the blue at the background.

 

You shouldn't really just put on a red filter and set it to AWB, because red filter only work down to 30 or 40 feet or so. Why else all the goPro flip filter need 3 different shade of red? There is no one red filter that work on a depth so MWB is still required.

My experiences have also shown that Filter + MWB produce the best results for "my shooting style".

Filter + AWB combination too often leads to color shifting within a clip, making grading more time consuming since it requires keyframing. For example: panning from surface, following a subject down almost always lead to color shift with AWB. Panning from front lit to back lit situations also create color shift with AWB. Even when a nearby diver enters the frame can cause color shift depending on the camera and situation.

Filter + MWB prevents the camera from adjusting colors constantly, which save time and headache "for my shooting style."

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However, there's no ABOSLUTELY THE RIGHT OR WRONG WAY for anything so if a person is happy with the "Filter + AWB" or "MWB only" results, then that's great also!

I am not sure I understand the logic. If you pan the camera or go into two environments with different light temperature is exactly when you want to compensate

That's the reason why you white balance each few meters?

If your temperature is fixed to the start of the clip and there are changes within it the end will be wrong. And there is nothing you can do with grading.

I think there is some confusion here between a studio situation with lights and grading and ambient light custom white balance.

...however once you have a filter there is no benefit whatsoever performing custom white balance auto works just fine.

 

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If your temperature is fixed to the start of the clip the end will be wrong. And there is nothing you can do with grading.

If I set Filter + CWB under say 12m or 40ft of water to a white sphere or a gray tank then I aim the camera at a diver above me and follow the descent, the color of the gray wetsuit will remain pretty constant throughout the clip.

If I use Filter + AWB, for the same shot, my cameras' AWB will change the color of the gray wetsuit from very warm to nutural in the same clip, which is not what I want.

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Yes, I can use color adjustment with keyframes to eliminate the color shift introduced by AWB without problem, but setting the camera to Filter + MWB lessen the need for that extra work.

You should never aim a filter upwards into the Sun as that creates hues and generally try to move the camera as little as possible. However unless you do shoot the sunball or a backlit situation there are no problems.

Look at my malta video no issue of any sort even with panning although the whole idea of panning is that you keep the line of the horizon fix or otherwise its not panning!

Either your camera has got issues or something is going on with the way you operate it

Let's not turn this forum into shooting style...... So only a few people here do color grading, and V-log may be better than CineD and CineV?

Moses I think colours are a matter of personal taste. I usually take a camera look at the picture styles that come out with it and see which one I like the most from there I typically only touch contrast take all JPEG shots with all settings and see which one may work best. JPEG shares the same processing of video in terms of image. I find this to be more effective that pursuing a dogma

 

If I set Filter + CWB under say 12m or 40ft of water to a white sphere or a gray tank then I aim the camera at a diver above me and follow the descent, the color of the gray wetsuit will remain pretty constant throughout the clip.

 

If I use Filter + AWB, for the same shot, my cameras' AWB will change the color of the gray wetsuit from very warm to nutural in the same clip, which is not what I want.

 

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Yes, I can use color adjustment with keyframes to eliminate the color shift introduced by AWB without problem, but setting the camera to Filter + MWB lessen the need for that extra work.

That is what would happen if the colour temperature is kept fixed with custom white balance whilst the light temperature changes.

The ambient light gets warmer or colder and auto white balance offsets exactly that reacting to the ambient light so that the colour stay as much as possible the same.

If you set custom white balance in your house in the shade then you go in a warm day sunlight outside colors will be off.

What you are saying is diametrically opposite to what actually happens unless you have a defective camera or you are moving it so fast that auto white balance can't react in this last case AWB performs the same as custom white balance

Maybe you should post some examples as what you say is not making any sense to me whatsoever. When we look at custom white balance we keep the camera at the same depth and same shooting angle or you need to re-adjust that is the whole idea of custom white balance as light temperature change

Still lots of rumours on DVX EOSHD forums about the up coming firmware. There seems to be a lot of folk in the know that 'something' is coming, but obviously aren't sharing the info.. might be more than just the v-log and there might be further improvements!