bghazzal

That looks good, with you with avoiding buoyancy on the sides, and keeping the rig compact with the lights close like this. And I also find it nicer to have the buoyancy above (so the rig "hangs" on it) than below (so it "pushes" the rig) - these 10bar compensate 400g each, right? What you could try is get a 10" 900g float above on the triple clamps, something like this one: https://www.puluz.com/v/3163499 This is what I use, and just cabletie additional floats to it as required. One thing you could also try is just add 5" arms to the lights, with 10bar or stix float, to bring the closer to neutral (these are next to the float, bottom right) Shouldn't mess much with the balance, but will compensate 150g or so off the lights themselves, and will give you more flexibility in positioning if using triple clamps. Maybe try to get open triple clamps if you can, to give you more options with a centrally mounted float

This is really huge - best uploaded to youtube as Davide suggested. That said, I'm curious - when/if you have time, do you think you could shoot an ambient light 10 second clip in flat (WB native, GoPro color) followed by one in the same place/conditions in Natural color (I think the new gopros have options to change settings easily, right?) Just ambient light (if you use artificial lights as a dominant light source it's best to set to the kelvin of your lights), properly exposed, reasonable depth for ambient light your locale (say 15m?) one in flat (WB native / GoPro color) the other one in Natural color. If you can have some sort of white balance ref (sand, tank, bubbles, slate...) it would be great. I don't expect much without a filter to help balance in post, but I'm really curious to give the flat clip a spin, so how what data is on there with the technological advances, and also how flat results compare to the natural color one, especially with the increased colour bit rate and everything. Just keep it small (10 seconds each) as I'm on an old laptop. There must be a lot more information to work with, and regardless of the locales, I'm really interested in how the data behaves compared to what I have on the GP7, and also how graded re-white balanced results compare to baked natural color profile. (and on a purely selfish note, I'm also curious if my laptop can still handle the files....) On water colour, where I was in Mexico (Gulf of California / Sea of Cortez) is generally green water as well btw - it does clear up some months (and temperatures do rise to 29°C in August before dropping), but otherwise heavy planktonic and generally green. Japan is a mixed bag, but water is generally surprisingly blue despite being temperate like Europe or colder in the north. Where I was working (Hachijo) had a mixed subtropical environment, including underwater like you can see here, with some hard coral (thanks to the Kuroshio, water temp doesn't drop below 17°C in winter) but also more temperate characteristics. Volcanic, and characteristics somewhat closer to Macaronesia I have some old GoPro4 Mediterranean clips (from Hyeres, so somewhat greener water) in flat somewhere, but not accessible here unfortunately... cheers b

Welcome Valerie, lovely vids always great to see more video-inclined people joining up 😄 Best of luck for the GH5 - otherwise changing the entire electronics should solve the issue. cheers ben

yep... Too cropped on the dual screen format in to judge corners, colours at depth are terrible on both to be fair, which is expected on cameras unable to understand / process the underwater environment I wish we had some reviewers actually working, even basically, on the footage, showing ungraded flat footage and quickly graded results, and when I say graded I especially mean white-balanced footage for instance. It's not difficult, and would give an idea of what is actually possible, when one is not crippling the camera's potential by forcing it to do things it will struggle with in such an environment (= auto wb, auto colors underwater) In a way, these auto-settings reviews are the equivalent of photographers comparing camera models by shooting photos in P mode or iA mode "because that's what most people will use"... Anyway 😅 Other than the wider fov, the DJI seems to handle low light better, that's what stands out the most

Very interesting subject Shelby. One thing I’ve been thinking about is maybe making a distinction between video (moving-pictures) as a format and video as a medium. As a format, we are clearly in a video centric world, a tendency which started as television sets became accessible and mainstream. It would be difficult to quantify this, as we can’t say really quantify attention received by the print industry with that of television and cinema, but as a format, since the tap of television was fully opened and brought moving-pictures out of the cinema and into everyone's living-rooms, the balance with written words, illustrations, still-pictures began to shift rapidly. If we fast-forward to our current digital connected online-age, this is even clearer. As technological advances (digital video compression, effective codecs and bandwith) made it possible, video - again as a format - quickly took over online (and spaces like this forum are just leftovers of an age gone-by, where the written word was still dominant online format...). This includes streaming, youtube, vlogs, tiktok and all the rest... It’s generational, but most people are now more likely to seek spoken / filmed information than written / printed data (whereas old farts like myself prefer skim reading than listening to a talking head meandering about a subject 😁) Yet when we come to video as an actual medium, things are a little less clear, especially in our field of underwater imaging. Yes, video shooting is now accessible and somewhat easier, we have action cams, phones and even instant editing apps that can auto-edit, auto-colour correct – and all still cameras can shoot video to some extent - and yet anyone who does video can testify that beyond the short-clip, it's still a rather painful process to actually share video content online, and that the audiences reached with video content are also way more limited than with still picture distribution. Instagram - the dominant image-sharing app - has strict limitations on video length, and their platform format is really designed for phone uploads, which makes it near-impossible to work with for sharing anything more than a 0:59 second clip... And even that is not easy, as you do need to upload (from a phone...) at some point, which is a really headache after editing on a computer, which is still unavoidable for most projects... And don't get me started on vertical vs. horizontal, portraits vs. landscape formats, bah, humbug! And generally, our almighty algorithm overlords are quite finicky when it comes to video content... Or take this beautiful forum: it has member galleries, and yet there is no way to upload videos (which would saturate servers), so they have to be shared from hosting platforms like Youtube and Vimeo (which is restricted / subscription based). In the field of underwater imaging, still-pictures dominate. By far. Again, just look at Waterpixels, out of the current member-base, how many of us focus exclusively – or primarily – on video? And this is not new, it was the same on Wetpixels and elsewhere… Just take a look at any underwater imaging publication – other than the latest action-cam or latest glamorously unaffordable-for-most cinecam release info, what percentage of the discussion is actually dedicated to video as an underwater imaging medium? And out of actual physical imaging devices made, other than action cams, what percentage of the products are actually primarily video-focused? Do people mostly shoot stills or videos on their phones? This does not mean that underwater videos aren't made of course. But what I mean to highlight here is that few people are actually pursuing underwater videography as their medium of choice, and that these numbers are probably dropping. To which people will like answer but what of the ubiquitous action cams and phones, which are the first imaging equipment bought by divers, think selfie-sticks, etc, etc. And yes, it is certainly true a lot of divers will try to film their dives, especially when they start diving, but beyond the resulting memento footage to share on socials, how many among them actually keep at it after filming a few of their first dives ? Yes, how many of these divers, after having action-cam'ed their first bubbles and turtles, actively continue underwater video making, spend time editing, look at other videos, try to build something in the medium, share content? Most of the things I now see posted (Scubaboard, the 2 or 3 zombie UW video FB groups...) are now mostly such "film-my-dive" content, showcasing a dive, a divesite, a trip - some good, some bad - along with some "check-out-this-crazy-thing-I-saw" type clips. Nothing wrong with this, I do slideshows myself, but the percentage of constructed pieces, or piece - showing something else is actually very very small. And they are usually done by the same active shooters entering UW photo competitions in the UW video category, Alex B's Freediving under ice in Greenland at amazing icebergs to take a recent local example, for instance. Other than that, you have the billion talking-head gear-reviews feeding the machine (Moloch whose factories dream and croak in the fog!) - and usually with very little underwater footage shown - along with promotional/commercial content (liveaboard, resort, tourism area with some diving), often done by semi-professionals hired for the job. These productions, fueled by commercial interests, occupy a slightly different sector in the world of underwater imaging (as a sidenote, other than people of consequent financial means, a lot of pro to semi-pro videographers started by working on such promo content for liveaboards or resorts for instance), with a set purpose, economy and ecosystem... And lastly we have professional documentary productions which we all know. Large productions with a budget, a dedicated film crew of sorts, or projects toeing the line, like local/scientific documentary projects (Underwater Italy to give take another local example). An underwater cameraman like Roger Munns would be a good example of inspiring work, but working in a professional environment which is disconnected from what most amateurs video enthusiast operate in. These operators and productions are in a world of their own (though technical advances and the development of more flexible commercial distribution outlets such as streaming platforms are making the border between semi-profession and professional productions more porous - I'm thinking of Alex Del Olmo / Behind The Mask Netflix collaborations hinted at recently for instance). So yes, action cam (and maybe, phone) clips are generally the first toe dipped in the sea of underwater imaging, but let's face it, for those that stick to UW imaging, they are also often a gateway to still-picture making... Why? Well for one thing, there are multiple concrete advantages to still-images shooting: - equipment is more accesible, and somewhat cheaper (strobes vs. video lights), or at least with a wider budget range information is generally more readily available, in many forms it's just easier to share still pictures, and there is more of a community of people will to engage in discussion, or just more shooters in general. Resorts, masterclasses etc are usually geared at still-shooters, not moving-picture weirdoes video is much more time consuming (selecting clips, choosing music if any, editing, publishing, sharing) than stills, which are more compatible with a busy life and also with phones as a content sharing device (which is why a lot of video content now is merging with the written work, subtitled and captioned to be consumed in silence during transit for instance...) - stills are generally more gratifying. You can put your signature on the pictures (so they are not stolen by evil online copyright pirates, of course...), have your galleries on instagram, on a forum or flickr, publish in online and physical mags, and have access to a more dynamic competition environment for those that are interested in this technically - I won't stir an outrage by paraphrasing Alex Del Olmo's recent provocative words in X-Ray mag stating that shooting stills is actually easier than shooting video - but underwater stability is certainly less of an issue when freezing a frame for seconds or less, as is whitebalancing / lighting, which are more straightforward with strobes, and still editing in lightroom is just not in the same timeframe as video editing, colour correcting – oh, and storage is actually easier... Video files are huge! (and require more computational power to edit...) Macro, macro, macro... Shooting macro video is tricky (working distance, stability) and quite a few of the star-subjects of macro photography (nudibranchs for instance) are rather static and usually make rather poor macro video subject, and then need to be complemented by creative lighting and editing solution to not bore viewers too quickly (yes, I am thinking of Dustin Adamson's nudi snooting slideshows and of Fred Miri Schaschl's whacky edits here) Lastly stills are probably more “artistic” - a very broad and provocative statement I know, but what I mean by that is that for stills, there is more of a focus on the photographer’s eye, compositional creation and vision of the subject, whereas video is generally more "naturalistic", highlighting the subject's behaviour and movement, and/or "story-based" (YMMV, take Behind The Mask’s current dramatic, sometimes neo-MTV-clips approach to video making for instance, and the attention-grabbing speed ramping trend which is - thanksfully - finally going out of style somewhat - but drone shots are still everywhere...) Sure, a good picture also needs to tell a story, as stated in the opening chapter of most photography 101 books, and yet this is really more literal for video. In my opinion there is quite difference between the story told by a picture and the actual dramatisation (story telling) created by narrative editing, voice-overs (ever so popular in current UW videos...) or even BBC style over-dramatisation, with zanny foley tracks and all.... All in all, I think it’s something of a paradox – as a format, moving pictures are everywhere, it’s never been easier to film underwater, and yet the medium of underwater videography is dying-out in a way (which is probably linked to the way content is consumed), at least when it comes to underwater imaging. Or re-inventing itself, to say the least... Recently, as I was looking for info on UR-Pro filters, I ended up drifting into ancient Wetpixel threads – it’s amazing how active the video section was around 2005-2010, with people actively exchanging and trying to figure things out within what was then a new medium of digital video. Where are they now, and where are their successors? Other than a few exceptions, like Dustin Adamson who seem to compete in most UW video competitions, most moved on, passed-away, shoot stills, do talking-head gear reviews, you name it... But this underwater videography boom is over, gone. Just compare this lively 20-year-old scene with the of scene today, where 90% of video content is related to discussing recent action cams and their oh-so frustrating limitations (which lead most video makers to move to something else anyway...), and very little content actually shared. In this, underwater video is currently a paradoxical medium - simultaneously more accessible, omnipresent, and yet in a state of flux, and more dead than alive, in its classical form at least. Video-game inspired 360° immersive content might seem like the future, but this also doesn't seem to be catching-on too well, probably because once the technical novelty is gone, this format doesn't blend too well with the narrative aspects of videography. Interestingly, we've been seeing a lot of super-slowmotion short clips recently, which probably works better on phones and instagram / soclal - but in slowing doing the movement to the extreme, is this not moving video clips closer to stills photography? (animated GIFs anyone?) The same cannot really be said of still-photography, which is alive and well in its own aging underwater niche and dive tourism-based ecosystem (after all, imaging gives divers something to do, to actively engage with underwater). Phones have also blown a new breath of life into photography, bringing a camera back into everyone's pockets. How will this translate for underwater still photography? The future will tell... And let's not forget computational (AI) imaging content is also just around the corner, so we'll see where all this takes us... cheers ben (disclaimer - it's 2024, so I'll add that I do not condone the actions of the Cousteau + Louis Malle team in this documentary or subsequent ones, and am simply posting this as a reminder that while there were others UW documentary productions before it, this 1956 documentary-fiction film was really one of the first underwater cinematographic endeavours to reach a wide, almost global audience...)

Wow - modesty, style and all the rest 😅 Surely they need to keep up with the other 2 cameras - the only thing I see on that, erhm, trailer thing, is the flipscreen... Which is useless underwater, but likely indicates a desire to court the youtuber (sorry, content creator) market a bit more, as this is a move away from pure immersive / action fovs. We'll see. This is purely subjective, but out of the three action cam brands, this one feels a little more chaotic. And not as in iphone-disruption chaotic, more like, a little all over the place chaotic. But we'll see...

A CMC-3 would be nice as well. Something to keep up with AOI's UCL-900 Pro for instance. Their UCL-90 Pro is also fantastic, bright and already offers a stronger magnification than the CMC-1. As much as I love my CMC-1, let's hope there's some movement on the the CMC line as well, for us little people 😁

Flexarm has been around for a while, and yes, quality is good. I've used two of their flexarms since 2016. Looks good - Your setup reminds me of the SRP tray I once had, boomerang shaped with two handles. It really helped on the GoPro4, which had no stabilisation (and wasn't waterproof either...) Then I started working in diving and was just shooting ambient in ambient light, stabilisation (hypersmooth etc) was introduced on the GoPro5. I got rid of the tray just handheld the GoPro housing directly, which worked fine - this was my hyperminimalist actioncam setup for years, always clipped on the BCD. But with heavy lights, this is not going to be an option. The lens is also a little heavy but my manageable on such a small camera. What solution are you going for in terms of buoyancy compensation? I'm guessing arms for the lights? Horizontal float above the camera are also nice (you can use triple clamps for the lights for instance), and help bulk-up the setup, which is nice to handle.

Hi Nick and thanks for the input and confirmation. It's good to know that the lens mount does block the DJI's WB sensor. For action cams, I shoot in flat profile and WB in post as detailed in this thread here so wasn't concerned about this, but knowing that a lot of action cam users plan on using auto-colors / auto-wb, it's important to know that the lens might affect auto settings in some way. I actually have the AOI UWL-03 lens, which I tested on my GoPro and like it a lot. After all these years on the GoPro, I must say focal distance and fov width has not been my primary concern, however corner distortion introduced since the fov change from GP4 to GP5 and up has really been tough to deal with, and my main issue with image quality... Before the wide lens, I was shooting the GoPro4 in medium fov, and switched to cropped linear since the GoPro5 (examples showing the corner distortion introduced by the change of GoPro fov here). Which is why the wide lens is a fantastic addition, as it finally solves this corner distortion / softness issue... Since I'm not really shooting with action cam at the moment, I only tested the lens on quick tests shots when it arrived, while simultaneously testing gel filter options to replace my faithful UR-Pro Cyan. But even with such quick and dirty tests freediving holding the two GoPros in each hand, I must say results were very convincing, and the GoPro corner issue was finally resolved (the dual lens/non-lens test clip + details on testing parameters in this post here ) That said, I was also considering to renew my action cams and found the DJI Action4, then 5 to be the most promising alternative to GoPros for underwater use. However, if the DJI Action + wide lens combination re-introduces corner issues that I'm specifically looking to avoid - after putting up with it all these years - then I'm afraid the DJI is no longer an option for me. This is a little disapointing as I was really looking forward to moving on from GoPro (and the Insta360 Ace pro has other specific issues), and the DJI Action range looked the most promising for underwater videography. cheers ben

Speaking of scammers and security... 😳 (brutally honest choice of forum section to post in btw) Or wait, maybe I'm not reading this right and this is just for night dives? 😅😇

As an important note, the DJI Action 5 camera uses a "color temperature sensor" for auto wb and colour adjustements, which is located on the front of the camera, as shown here in the manual's diagram (item 5, basically inside the "O" letter of the word Osmo, under the lens) This seems to have been taken into account in wide lens mount design, with a cutout on the mount, as shown here: Hopefully this design is effective and the lens base is wide enough to let sufficient light hit the sensor. If it doesn't and the lens actually covers the colour sensor, this will mean that the DJI Action5 can't be used with auto-wb / auto colors settings (not that you should underwater anyway 😉) when coupled with AOI / Backscatter (and potentially Inon?) type lenses... There is also a pressure sensor, but AFAIK this is not coupled with wb/colour correction, unlike the late Paralenz cameras, for example. Let's hope we can get confirmation on this as well 🤞

If planning on using it with a 3rd party wide angle lens like the AOI UW-03, please check this post: Some field of view issues need to be looked into, as the DJI Action 5 - in wide mode at least - is wider than the GoPro Wide fov for which these lenses were designed for, which seems to introduce corner distortion when coupled with the wide lens as shown in the tests. It remains to be determined if other fov / crop settings can be used to neutralize this corner distortion. Another aspect to look into would be if the position of the DJI Action 5's "color temperature sensor" has been taken into accound - if wide and other accessory lenses cover the sensor, then the camera will not be able to be used in auto-wb / auto-color. More info on this here

As a heads up, photographer Jun Shimizu recently posted a very interesting comparative test on Japanese online publication Oceana.ne.jp, pairing the AOI UWL-03 with the following action cams: GoPro12 Black GoPro13 Black Insta360 Ace Pro DJI Osmo Action4 (the DJI Action 5 came out as the article was being published, so not tested) The full article, in Japanese, is available here: https://oceana.ne.jp/diving/diving-equipment/144648 The tests were based on 4K video footage, 16:9 aspect ratios, wide mode - and aimed to compare auto-color / light management and general image quality. The tester left the other settings to default auto. Tests are what they are, without a massive difference between cameras but enough to differentiate them, especially in the handling of blues (personal sidenote/disclaimer - I have little interest in auto-wb / auto-colors, being convinced that underwater, beyond the shallows, cameras always require working in post to give the best results possible, and that a flat profile + adequately designed filter is generally the best way to help rebalance colours for uw video - something developped here) However, and this is where it gets very interesting, while the results are somewhat similar on all four cams, there appears to be a marked difference in corner sharpness / corner distortion on the DJI Action 4, which, in Jun Shimizu's video tests, seems to have terribly soft corners when paired with the AOI UWL03 wide lens... I’ll let you judge the captures for yourselves: (images by Jun SHIMIZU, source Oceana.ne.jp) GoPro12 GoPro 13 Insta360AcePro DJI Action4 (!) GoPro12 GoPro13 Insta360 AcePro DJI Action4 (!) GoPro12 GoPro13 GoPro13 Insta360 AcePro DJI Action4 (!) To make things clearer, if we focus on the DJI Action4 horizontal/landscape test results only: DJI Action4 + AOI UWL-03, 4K 16:9 video captures, corner distortion... Ouch, right? Kind of defeats the purpose of the AOI UWL-03, if a better corner quality cannot be obtained, unfortunately. As is, such test results come as a bit of shock for people like myself who'd managed to convince themselves that the DJI Action range was currently the most promising option for underwater videography. However, before we relegate the DJI to non-compatible with the AOI wide lens and also as pretty-hopeless-for-underwater-video category, please note that there is a important caveat to these test results Given the number of field of view / crop options, it's not really 100% clear what settings were used for these rather unforgiving tests The tester mentions that he just set to 4K video, wide and 16:9 aspect ratio, but left the other settings on default auto settings. When it comes to the soft corners of the DJI action 4 the article mentions that the soft corners already appeared when setting to wide on land. Having noticed the issue, he mentions trying a narrower fov to try to improve corners on this camera, but the corner deformation problem remained. So this could mean an error in / or suboptimal settings, or, in the worst case scenario, an actual fov compatibility issue with between DJI Action cams AOI UWL-03... Looking into the DJI Action range fov/crop settings in the manual and also through the gazillion land tests offered by the army of Youtube talking-heads shillfluencers, it seems that the less distorted fov/setting on the Action4/5 would be something called: standard dewarp Rocksteady enabled Not sure if this mouthful of a setting is the one used here, since the article mentions 16:9, wide mode and "auto settings" (but also trying to narrow the fov, which would imply changing the fov settings somehow) - i’ve asked Jun Shimizu for confirmation of settings used on the Action4, but haven't had an answer yet. Also, as a reminder, tested here is the Action4, not the newer Action5 (though there's no real reason to expect a radical change in fov/crop settings, from what I've seen). Lastly, this not mentioned in the article, but the video footage looks handheld individually as opposed to set on a mounting tray (which would explain some fov difference). However, based on this and other footage, the angle/perspective ratio seems consistent enough to conclude that the Action4 is fov is generally wider, which could explain the corner issue when coupled with the AOI wide lens designed for a narrower fov (in wide mode, at least...) Nonetheless, this is important news for use with the AOI UWL-03 wide lens, and something which should definitely be looked into for UW use with the combo. After seeing these results, I then peeked into available hardware/ lens / fov info for these action cam models. It's not crystal clear, but the info I could find on action cam lenses, paired with the equivalent of GoPro's wide mode (which is recommended with the AOI UWL 03) and sensor data is as follows: (note: fov angles given are probably based on horizontal measurements, as this is not specified for other cams than the GoPros, which has the most precise specs) - Action5 = 155° (f/2.8), 116° in standard dewarp Rocksteady enabled (1/1.3-inch sensor ) - GoPro13 = 109° (wide, hypersmooth) (f/2.5) (1/1.9-inch sensor) - Ace Insta360Pro = ???? 155° field of view ? (f/2.6) - other modes? MaxView 170° (1/1.3-inch sensor) (if anyone has more precise info on the ACE360, please share it) As a reminder, AOI's slightly sibylline specs for the AOI UWL-03 wide lens indicate that with the GoPro (model unspecified), the AOI lens should give a magnification of 0.73x and also widens the underwater fov to 140°. Bit of a headache coming up, so I'll leave you guys to work it out... 😅 In conclusion, further UW testing is definitely in order for the DJI Action4/5 range, especially with AOI UWL-03 Wide lens, and prospective DJI Action5 + AOI UWL-03 users should definitely look into the corner / fov issue before pulling the trigger... **** EDIT - looking into additional test footage from other sources, the DJI Action 4's difference in fov seems to be confirmed by other side-by-side comparaisons found online. The DJI Action4 is noticeably wider (in wide mode, at least) which could explain corner distortion/softness issues when paired with a wide lens such as the AOI UWL-03... 😮 There are plenty of side-by-side comparaisons on the shillfluencer YT channels, but here's a random example capture (source ) showing the fov difference (without the AOI wide lens) or on this one here (source), also showing the fov difference in wide mode (again without the AOI wide lens) All that said and done, even if the DJI Action4 does have a wider fov in wide mode than the GoPro and Insta360 Ace Pro - which could be causing a marked corner distortion when coupled with a wide lens designed for an narrower fov - it would be good to know if there are other fov on the Action 4/5 which allow it to be used with the lens efficiently without degrading the corners this way. Let's hope we can have some dedicated confirmation tests / footage for the DJI Action 4/5 + AOI UWL-03 lens combo in the near future, just to know what works (or doesn't) ! cheers ben

If anyone is interested, this is what the replacement SUPE MS-10 light is doing: Interestingly enough, the light has a long-press operated dimmer mechanism, so I wonder if this is not what is getting in the way of it working properly. The colours LED are also a way of indicating battery charge, a design commonly found in Chinese manufactured products. Here in this case, the control-circuit clearly has some sort of issue. I think SUPE uses a similar button on other light products, so this might be something to look out for. I have given all the info to SUPE, but as I am not willing to shoulder replacement costs given the circumstances, this is the end of line. cheers ben

As a sidenote to this thread, current and bonfire-type dives don't mix 😅 I had an interesting experience yesterday evening, current stronger than expected. To put it simply, the majority of critters can't seem to be able to keep up with the current and stay close to the static lure (which isn't so much of issue with blackwater diving since both the lure and divers are drifting). Yesterday's dive was pretty empty, with lots more fish than usual, and some of the usual suspects, but not much of a build-up. cheers b

Fantastic, thanks Giancarlo - that's perfect and good to know - I was really wondering if the action would build up during the night, but I guess earlier in the evening is closer to breakfast-time for feeding critters - will definitely bring a windbreaker for the boat 👍 cheers

If I'm to summarize the information collected from BW video shooters, recommended strobe positions are mostly variations of the following: earmuff-style positioning, for subjects at a certain distance from the lens/port (unlit background) earmuff-style positioning, for subjects closer to the lens/port (unlit area between port and subject) These two basic positions can also be angled in (for better rendition of transparency for instance) or out, like this for instance: earmuffs, slightly angled out For larger subjects / wider scenes, it's a variation of the typical wide-angle video light setup, but mitigating backscatter by either angling out or pulling the lights behind the port: lights pulled in behind the port lights more forward but angled out: Other consideration would be video light verticality - lights level with the port or above (and angled down), for instance... cheers ben

Thanks - 23-26°C is quite cold indeed... If I wear a wetsuit in the tropics it's a 5mm... Did that in Thailand, Indonesia, but i was working there and doing 3 to 4 dives a day on liveaboards, so getting cold easier. 26/27°C is the average Komodo temp, and it's 5mm and hood for most, myself included... 24°C is not uncommon and that gets really cold I think I will be ok with my 5mm + top and hood - I hate 7mm, and prefer diving dry if it comes to that (regular temps under 23°C for instance). My current 5mm is still fairly new - in Palau, where i was working last I dived without a suit all year, just a top and leggings, so the suit stayed in a cupboard. Palau's not too far from the Philippines so was expecting similar temps in the 29°C zone... ouch... In east Bali where I am now, average is 29° - i've been diving suitless the past two years, with just my old top and leggings, but do bring out the 5mm for night dives, super comfy and also great protection for the scooter ride home, which is freezing... cheers

Thank you. Yes, it was quite amazing to see who'd showed up on a shore dive. But the location itself is very rich, and facing 1500m+ depths in the strait. What got me interested in giving it a go here is both the fact that weird larval critters sometimes show up on day dives and also the abundance of swarmies on certain night dives under certain conditions. It's just scratching the surface, but from what I've seen there are regulars (different types of shrimps, worms, plankton and larval forms), and also more occasional visitors, including pelagic larva (marlin etc), which is likely due to proximity to the strait. Handling the swarming is tricky, especially for video, but good practice for deep black water diving. I'm glad you like the speed - while it can be frustrating to lose details in the motion blur, I think it's also nice to see the actual movement and behaviour (downright odd at times with the spinning backflips), which is not something shown that often... cheers! ben

Thanks! I did try 1080p 60fps, but on my camera the drop in image quality is really too much I think. Another thing that put me off is that while 60fps 50% slow-motion is great to extend the footage, critters that don't hang around and zoom in and out are usually too fast to get a clear motion at 50% playback, it wasn't as dramatic as I thought. 120fps would probably be the way to go for this kind of thing... That said, if I did have 4K 60fps, I would definitely shoot in that, as it's more practical, but until we have a longer outlook on a place to base ourselves with regular diving opportunities, a kit upgrade (sweetly priced GH5 kit for instance) is off the financial and material books 😁 I'm already waking up in cold-sweat at the thought of having to do Bali-Okinawa with our luggage... 😅

Thanks a bunch - it's still very fresh as I'm still figuring out what works best in this setting, but the fact that pretty funky critters showed up despite my modest lure-light setup was really a pleasant surprise. Someone should try in a deep lake on a moonless night, just to see what happens (just saying 😁)

Thanks Giancarlo! I'm actually ok with doing just one dive at night - I'm doing this here in Bali, entering the water at 7 to 7:30pm, and by the time I'm out, equipment rinsed, soaked and I'm desalted and fed I usually end up sleeping at 11pm to midnight (yes, I'm slow). I could do one morning dive and one night BW for instance, it's ok. 3 night dives is bordering fanatical, but I get it 😄 Some additional questions: Did you return to the resort between the dives? If there are a lot of subjects, 2 dives would mean changing the battery on the boat - video is not forgiving - which is not something I'm a fan of anyway) Also did you notice any behavioural / subject type change as it got later? As I've said, I'm diving not long after sunset here, 7/7:30pm, but I can't help wondering if later would be better, as the great migration probably takes a bit of time to get underway And lastly, how cold does it get in February? At night here I dive in a 5mm with light hood here and I'm fine at 29°C (no wetsuit during the day), but when I was working in Komodo the same 5mm felt quite chilly at 26/27°C (or even 24 to 21C° on a strong rising tide from the deeper south...) 26/27°C is basically on the line for me, can do an hour but not much more. And on a boat at night, brrrr thanks! That's good to know, thanks! I'll get in touch in the near future, see what's possible 🙂

Now for gritty gritty video-centric questioning… If I break it down, here are the main issues and interrogations these bonfire-style three tests have brought up for shooting video: Video lights becoming lures... The first major issue I’m having is dealing with my 2x video lights becoming lures themselves… At first I thought this was mostly an issue of not having enough lure lights (so the swarm would reform next to the strongest light source, ie my 2x 8000lm video lights), but while this is certainly true close to the light source, this also happens on the outskirts of the lure light cone, where the more interesting / manageable subjects seem to be hanging out... 😎 Anilao blackwater drifting downline as invented by Mike Bartick vs. homemade bonfire rig... 😅 Turn on the camera's video lights, and a swarm forms, even at a good distance from the lure lights... Meaning that just adding more lure lights probably won’t solve the issue - as soon as you turn on the camera video lights, the lights become lure themselves, so we have to work with and around this. This is both a video specific issue and, I’m guessing, also probably something more specific to shallow bonfire dives. I might be mistaken, but I imagine that open ocean blackwater diving probably doesn’t, in most cases, have as much swarming, at least not the frenzy you get to the shore, which would help a lot for shooting video, to isolate subjects. Critters swarming onto the camera’s video lights means that subjects become more active as they enter a feeding frenzy (or whatever it is they do...), and also that, plus the mass makes it very difficult to isolate a subject efficiently. Another issue is that the lights being on the camera, they come way too close to focus efficiently, even with my Inon +6 diopter. So this video-lights-becoming-lures has been a major issue with my bonfire-style setup... One solution would be to use the lights on a lower setting. And this is precisely where I hit another hurdle, video light power vs. video light positioning... Video light positioning and video light power These dives take place in very rich waters, so not only critters but phytoplankton and particules, the works. Like for still photography, backscatter is a major issue, as is lighting translucid critter correctly and not becoming a lure... Looking at strobe positioning and also the very rare examples I have of people shooting BW video, I’ve narrowed it down to 2 positions which work best for dealing with backscatter. - using the edges of the video light cones, after pulling the lights behind the port, lights facing outwards outward facing video lights, with the frontally mounted spot beam, showing the crossbeam triangle This is a position I need to experiment with more, as I was a little shy and afraid of attracting too many critters. - ear-muff type lighting, where you create a sort of light box in front of the port, more or less angled inwards slightly forward facing earmuff style light positioning, with shades on the lights This second position is actually what I've been using the most. However - and this is probably both a constant out video-light + bonfire swarming specific issue - I'm still very much figuring out what works best in this case... As a caveat, having two powerful video lights is still new for me - before that I was working with a main centraly mounted MW4300 complemented by two weak video-lights on the side for macro and supermacro (and ambient light + filter for wide angle) I recently got two Hydra 8000 lm lights, for this type of shooting, blue water and medium shots, so it's all still very fresh. And unfortunately, the task-heavy environment like the bonfire one isn't the easiest to figure out what works, and land tests can only help as much... I based myself on whatever info I could find online for strobes, eg: capture from Nicolai Deutsch's Insider Divers YT tutorial series, showing a classic wide positioning capture from Simon Lorenz's Insider Divers Youtube tutorial series, showing "ear muff" positioning And also refering to the precious advice given by a couple of people actually shooting black-water type video (rare!) capture from Alexander Semenov's Aquatilis / Ponza video shoot, "ear muff" style... Back to the actual in-water results, lights angled out to use the edges of the of the video light cones works well for backscatter, and gives me more of a visual reference for subject tracking. However, I then need enough power for the light to reach where my main focus area will be. I do have sufficient light power with the Kraken pair, it works fine at 6000 lm for small critters BUT then the swarming happens fast, and is quite crazy. I have less than 30 seconds to shoot before hell breaks loose, and my subject usually starts going wild before then, making following / focusing very tricky. More than backscatter, it’s more abundance of subjects partying in my lit focusing area which is an issue... Other issue is that even if my central subject is well lit, I’ll be lighting up others in the frame, really no way around it in this context – and one thing I’ve noticed - and which you can see on quite a few sequences in the clip I’ve posted above - is that critters have a tendency to let themselves drop in the water column.... I think this is related to feeding by basically they come up to the light and drop, almost not moving horizontally. This is ok to shoot, but you can see the downwards movement of the camera + critter dropping together as the other critters move up in the frame, motion blur which highlights anything lit up in the frame... post-larval flounder - East Bali bonfire tests With a more closed-in, inward-facing ear-muff style position (eventually adding shades to the lights to avoid lens flare, though this might actually be counterproductive in the case with my 100° beams, the jury is out...), I can use a much lower power setting, which means less swarming, and is better for staying the subject. But for this, lens flare is risky, as I can’t really review shots as a still photographer would. And even locking myself in a dark room with bits of translucid plastic bag hanging from fishing line to test things out (yes, I'm that desperate), it's very difficult to recreate in-water conditions, which means I'm trying to figure it out on the fly... subject spotting/tracking before turning on the main lights And other than that, there is another issue - subject tracking - with the lights not facing forward I’m basically blind until I get the subject inside the light box / focus area This is very very frustrating, as can I spot a subject above the camera, but then have a hard time getting it in the light box to follow it. One way to try to get around this is to use a focus beam, like BW photographers do - a narrow forward facing beam, allowing me to narrow in on the critter before turning on the lights. I've been playing with this, but this has proved tricky as well. I’ve tried with a snoot video light (before it started acting up again, see here) with a powerful but very narrow beam (5°) - but while this works well, it’s also too narrow to spot with in camera efficiently. I then tried with one of the Archon dive lights with a 16° beam, but it was a little too wide (and it is a dive light, even if I add a homemade snoot, not being a video light it will have a hotspot, and probably won't blend too well with the two lights...) Using the MW4300’s 14° narrow beam sounds like a good middle-ground alternative, but then I lose one of my main lure lights... hmmm.. Nonetheless, this is what I’ll probably trying in the future, and the ability to spot / track critters on the outskirts seems more important than the power of the lure lights in this kind of setup free-swimming tozeuma shrimp in the fray - East Bali bonfire tests Depth of field / focusing area Shooting small fast moving critters is tricky, focusing of course but also dealing with subject abundance in the focusing area... I shoot in manual and use focus peaking to see what’s going on, because depth of field is just to narrow for my autofocus to handle (which would be confused and probably won’t be reactive enough anyway). Tests on land showed that the auto-AF was unable to adjust properly. Most of the shots are zoomed to my compact’s 50mm lens equivalent, which is a good compromise (more zoomed out is too shaky, hard to spot, and wider is too small) I’ve been shooting mostly with a +6 diopter, as I found the extra magnification helpful in this situation, and also helps critters moving closer to the lens. But zoomed out to 50mm, I don’t have much leeway and the diopter helps. Or does it? basically the diopter's small magnification factor means I can zoom in less (which is less shaky, and potentially helps with DOF, but then we need to take into account the +6's effects on DOF as well), and focus closer (but very close to the lens, light position usually becomes a problem, repositioning, avoiding lens flare etc...) This is also still unclear - recent on-land tests I did showed that at f11, I can focus almost almost the port glass even at 50mm, so I might be making it harder for myself with the diopter (more risks of flares etc), magnification is a double-edged sword indeed... Of course it would be easier if I had a standard 60mm macro lens like a normal person, but where's the fun in that, right? 😉 down and down we go, dropping together in the water column... East Bali bonfire tests For focusing, overall, it really depends on the critter’s type of movements. Feeding shrimps are really erratic, but worms and fish are easier to follow, using peaking as a ref. If I had light positioning figured out, it also would help give a better reference of the focus area, and generally make life easier as well. At the moment it feels a bit like being blind at times, with the added difficulty of switching to the camera view and find the critter you’d spotted, and when to turn on the lights which is something I would need to work out. Using a set framing reference, as it has been suggested, would not work in this case as I wouldn't be able to see it above or in camera, and more importantly the depth of field is just too shallow to use efficiently. Exposure 400 ISO works well – but for shutter speed, shooting in 30fps (image quality at 1080p 60fps is just to low) I’ve resorted back to the 180° rule of shutter and shoot in 1/60 (*I usually bend the rule shoot at a higher shutter speed for macro/super macro, which gives me more flexibility and doesn’t actually result in a « saving private Ryan » look anyway). basic settings for bonfire tests However, given the type of movement I’m shooting I’ve been wondering if cinematic motion blur isn’t a bit too much – maybe 1/80 would be a good compromise for a little more detachment, if exposure can handle it, that is. Most of the shots were in f11 (which is the max on my compact) to f8, to try and maximise depth of field... Which leads us back to light power and positioning, loop closed, over and out...😅 *** As a temporary conclusion, I'd greatly appreciate tips on light positioning and subject tracking, as this has been quite difficult to experiment with in-situation. The issue is primarily how to minimise light power (to attract less critters) while still not being completely blind, while lighting up critters properly... I'm really starting to think a frontally mounted video light would help with tracking (but it would need to stay on as I film though), but just not sure where to start... cheers ben

Here's a little something I shot over 3 "bonfire" (light-trap) style dives, a setup I've been experimenting with here on the shores East Bali's Lombok Strait. Being alone in this venture, my bonfire setup is really basic, with very little lure lights to work with... It's not really much of a bonfire to be honest, more a modest campfire than anything, but hey, it is what is is, right? 🙂 Despite being all on my lonesome with a very light-limited setup, these experiment have nonetheless been rather interesting, with some surprising encounters. The dives also brought-up very video-centric questions on lighting power, positioning, spot focusing, and the relationship between video lighting’s constant light output and the lure lights, something I'll be developing in this thread (along with details on the lure setup used) Please note that I shot in 30fps, because I don't have 4K 60fps on my compact, so this video is probably a little different from the ultra-slow motion often seen for such critters. While I certainly do wish I had access to 60fps and its smooth 50% slow-mo for lightning fast subjects, I find I'm actually ok with a little erratic critter movement, as the real-life action itself is rather chaotic at times - let's just hope it won't have you reaching for dramamine pills... 😉 Equipment used: - Panasonic Lumix LX10 (LX9/LX15 in some locales) compact camera in a NALX10 Nauticam housing, Inon UCL-165M67 +6 diopter - 2 Kraken Hydra 8000V2 video lights - Lures lights: Backscatter MW 4300 video light and Archon dive lights - Shot in Amed, east Bali, in 4K 30fps, CineD profile, manual focus, 400 ISO cheers! ben

I've added some observations based on recent "bonfire-style" tests in this thread: some are quite video specific, but there are also general observations based on my experiments with this type of diving, which is certainly different from "true" deep black water diving, but also great practice... 🙂 cheers ben