Problems Blufin with Fathom for Xr520

Dave

I understand your frustrations but I think the temp workaround is to set SteadyShot to standard or turn it off. As for L&M, keep at them. They have to fix the issue since it was not disclosed at all. Thank you for bringing up the issue on WP as that'll help future buyers from suffering the same issues as yourself. Hopefully this gets resolved quickly.

Hi everyone,

Just got back from my first trip with the system, and had no vignetting issues at all! I did however have OLED problems with the monitor being perefect at the start of all dives, but reversing colours and ghosting so badly I couldn't tell what I was shooting for several minutes! It seemed to get worse as the dives came to an end?

I am sending the monitor back for a replacement asap! It cost me several shots, and at least one amazing shot that I couldn't tell was wrong when I shot it.

Here's a hint... When getting into the water quickly (like Whale Watching) always check to make sure the water hasn't flipped up your macro lens lever! The monitor was messed up, and I didn't notice, and shot a great seaquence of mother and calf coming up less than 4 metres away, and the whole thing is through the flip macro, and of course out of focus! AAAARrrrrrgggggggggggggg!! But that's user error, not an issue with the housing!

Onto the good though...

So glad I got the 110 lens... great piece of glass and was even more happy with it because we got with Humpback Whales all 3 days we were out! Swam with a mother and calf for two hours and the baby got within 2 metres of the lens! Just an amazing experience and the footage (being that close) has turned out better than I hoped for!

I even got footage of the calf suckling at the surface from beside and then as they swam past from 3 metres behind the mother, on the surface and they both dived right in front of me while suckling, you can even see the calf swallowing!!

VERY HAPPY MAN I was watching that! Goose bumps going down the spine the whole time!! Only lasted about 8-10 seconds, but what a thing to see!

Of course being too excited and being only the 3rd day with the system, (rather than a seasoned professional u/w videographer ) I zoomed in to keep the footage close, but over zoomed slightly and it went out of focus for the last 2-3 seconds, which I could have shot myself for doing afterwards! I had the shot, just got too excited. What a git!

But all in all I am over the moon with the whole system.

Lights were better than I thought with some comments on forums (not quite as good as my old Undersea Video lights, but pretty close).

Everything apart from screen was perfect, and haven't seen the vignetting issues some are having. So guess I'm lucky with that one.

Manual White Balance is a little whacky too. I see what L.Babcock is talking about now, it seems to work sometimes, and not others. Auto works ok sometimes, but manual works better and it just doesn't seem to correct all the time when you hit the button.

ANyway, just thought I'd report in and let you know how I got on.

Sorry to hear about the OLED monitor problems and hope L&M and their dealers fix it asap.

Just so there's no confusion about the vignetting issue, the problem occurs only when the Steady Shot is set to "Active" mode. Is that your setting? Or do you have it at "Standard" or off?

I believe his dealer tells everyone to turn the steady shot off :)

A little info at the beginning can solve a lot of issues before they happen.

Yeah but since when do your customers ever listen to you, Peter?

I absolutely agree that if all manufacturers (L&M in this case) or dealers selling the housing says BEFORE the transaction that it does have all these issues, then WP video forum would be just about technique and mods and fewer manufacturer issues with housings.

At least I heard that Fathom replace the rear Lense of the WP80. I heard also that Gates has not this Problem, because L&M has done the Job not very well. The Camera is to far from the lense, thats why the Vignetting coming up. I´m not sure, but when I forward the Camera a little then I have no Problems with Vignetting. Problem Filters didnt work then and also Touch Screen has Problems.

I have 4 Housings from L&M but this is the first one wher I be very disapointed. So much Money and promises and then this Kind of Problems. Hope they wil came up with a Solution soon. Otherwise I meet them during the Dema Show.

regards

Michael

I tried it, too and I am very satisfied. I installed the 'shim' as explained and after three dives I see no vignetting on the monitor any more. In post editing I found just one scene, where there was a little vignetting, but only a little bit just in the lower right corner and so minor, that you don't see it on a TV (non visible area). I continue to check.

Sascha

Just reading this thread - I wonder if the vignetting may also be aperture dependent? Sounds like the optics are at their tolerance limit and if so subtle shifts of aperture may just show up?

Doubt it Paul. The exposure controls are all electronic. Focus can possibly affect as that's still a lens but the point the camera lens parameters are all there. The issue is that the Fathoms lens design is NOT made for the newer cameras within the design parameters (where the flip filter can fit etc). They should not be sold without warning about the short-comings.

In this day and age, this sort of lack of information about the product is unnecessary.

Doubt it Paul. The exposure controls are all electronic. Focus can possibly affect as that's still a lens but the point the camera lens parameters are all there. The issue is that the Fathoms lens design is NOT made for the newer cameras within the design parameters (where the flip filter can fit etc). They should not be sold without warning about the short-comings.

In this day and age, this sort of lack of information about the product is unnecessary.

I think this kind of problem is more or less the same for all manufacturers. Years ago, I was pissed off when after reading my Ikelite housing was compatible with the UWL100 wide angle, I bought that lens just to realize the picture was totally distorted with some vignetting as well. I solved the problem but having a shorter port installed and got some perfect pictures then but none was mentionned at all on their website.

Some similar problem have occured on other brand. In fact I think no brand is perfectly trouble free because the camcorder market is moving so fast. But I agree that careful testing should be done and the limit of the product clearly documented as optics have substantial prices and people little tolerance when they have bad pictures after paying for some products to improve the quality of their shots.

I have just sent in my WP80 lens to Fathom Imaging to replace the insert to correct the vignetting ("upgrade to WP80A) ..$250.00

I have just sent in my WP80 lens to Fathom Imaging to replace the insert to correct the vignetting ("upgrade to WP80A) ..$250.00

Hi Daveerdoc,

Does that mean you will be able to use the full IS without issues now?

Do you know if they are doing the same upgrade for the 110 lens?

Did you ever put the Galapogas footage up on the web somewhere?

Looking forward to seeing what the results are like for you!

Dave, was that the best LMI could do after 3 months? That's dumbfounding!

Dave, was that the best LMI could do after 3 months? That's dumbfounding!

I basically worked with Fathom Imaging directly; L&M and Gates essentially use the same accessory lenses (just call them by different names); since all of the new Sony cameras use this image stabilizer circuit (I understand Canon is also using a similar style stabilizer), they had to come up with something. I do not like shooting with the stabilizer off on the small housings; there is just too much camera shake, especially when you're viewing on a large screen in full 1920x1080.

I tried various shims which seeming to only "shift" the vignetting (from the lower right corner to the rest of the corners). I even have an engineering friend with a 3X mill/lathe, and we moved the camera forward on the mounting by 3mm which did not help significantly, either.

I am not sure if they offer this for the Fathom 110 you will have to call Fathoms directly. Paul and Art are were very good to work with. I'll stick with my 90 for now, and I'll be sure to post once I have the lens back, and get it into the field for some more shooting..

I didn't have this camera in Galapagos; I had it for the Sardine Run: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kQT6kxvyTpc

The camera (XR520) in my housing (Bluefin Pro) does not precisely "look" through the lense's center.

It should be placed 2 mm or so to the left.

I think this would avoid black corners or that black border on the right side,

if I move the housing to fast aside.

Here is a copy of correspondence between myself and Fathom Imaging.

Please read this and comment as you see fit...

Hi Paul,</SPAN>

 

I have read about this on the Wetpixel forums.

 

I have the above system and want to use the Image Stabalisation feature without getting the vignetting issues, and I believe there is a way to get the lens altered to fix this problem?

 

Is it possible to get this done with the 110 lens? (the person on the forum had a 90 fixed by you).

 

What do I have to do to get this done to my Fathom 110 lens?

 

In August I was filming Humpbacks on the surface and found it frustrating not being able to turn I.S. on!

 

Thanks and hope to hear from you soon.

Malcolm:[/font]

 

Fathom does not manufacture or sell 110 lens. The 110 lens is a Chinese copy of a Fathom lens design. Only suggestion is to set I.S for wide angle converter. Setting is buried deep in the camcorders menu screen. The wide angle converter setting for I.S. will reduce the vignetting and provide an even more stable image. Will it eliminate the vignetting???

 

Fathom has repaired Chinese 80 and 90 deg FOV lenses, but there is no practical repair procedure for the complex 110 lens.

 

Regards,

 

Paul

Hi Paul,

 

Now I'm a bit freaked out! L

This is being promoted and sold (for a LOT of money) as a Fathom lens on Light & Motions website!

 

Just want to check, here is the list of lenses from their website… http://www.uwimaging.com/bluefin-optics.php

 

Sorry, may not have explained properly, it is the 4^th one on this list? Maybe it is a 106 actual lens from memory and from reading on the forums, but don't have it with me to check what the part number is etc.

 

Just confirm this is one of your lenses?! I'm sure my lens has "Fathom" on its bayonet fitting to attach it to the housing.

 

I understand if there is no repair on the lens available, although I am obviously disappointed, but understand it is a complicated piece of glass!

 

I just want to make sure I haven't been totally ripped off, and I don't have to go back to Light & Motion with a huge complaint! Part of the reason I purchased this system was the Fathom name on the lens!

"Fathom designed", "Fathom 80c", "Fathom 90" etc... Sure had me fooled!

 

"Fathom designed", "Fathom 80c", "Fathom 90" etc... Sure had me fooled!

Me too!

Just got home and checked, and my precious "Fathom" (proudly stated to all and sundry) is actually a UOM ( Universal Optics Manufacturing ) Chinese copy lens!

To say that these are "Fathom Designed" is INCREDIBLY misleading, and the fact that they are "Named" Fathom 80C, Fathom 100C, Fathom 110 etc is outright false advertising!!

WTF is L&M doing?!

How can they say they want to lead the UW Video Industry, and on the same website lie to potential and existing customers. Some "L & M Manager" will be bound to say "We never actually SAY it's a Fathom Lens, just a Fathom Designed lens", and "They are identical in every way to the Actual Fathom Lens" but that's bollocks! If it's a copy, fine, say it is, say how much cheaper it is than the Fathom, say it's an exact copy, and give customers the option, DON"T F$%&KIN LIE TO THEM!! And don't charge them like it's a Fathom lens either!

I am gutted, I am p!$$ed off!

I am not blaming the guy I purchased it through, but I do blame Light & Motion, and they should be held accountable!!

Buyer beware my a$$, one of the reasons I got a Light & Motion Bluefin Pro is my belief of how highly this company is thought of, and how well I would be looked after with spending that amount of money!

All of you Light & Motion customers that thought you owned a "Fathom Imaging" lens (like I did), check again, it may say "Light & Motion", but if it also says "UOM", you've been fooled! (Like me).

And what about Fathom Imaging, their name is being falsly used to help sell these systems, they have a VERY good reputation, and Light & Motion are charging USD$3999.00 for a Chinese copy FFS!!

Sorry, I may have gone too far, in the wrong forum, but I have to vent somewhere!

Lets hope Light & Motion see this and start doing something about it, I'm off to write a letter to them, of which they will probably already be coming up with witty and clever marketing speak, but this industry is too small for that! I can only hope they can fix this problem somehow??

(And learn from it)?

Signed: Eternally gutted.

Sorry have just come in late after a couple of glasses of vino, are you guys saying that L&M are stating that they use Fathom lenses but they are in fact Chinese lenses labeled Fathom.... but not the fathom as we all know!

Well it seems like there are products advertised as "Fathom" and products advertised as "designed by Fathom". I am also the proud owner of a "UOM" lense namely WP-80 you can find at least from Ikelite, Aditech and Zen Underwater. All those manufacturers says "it has been designed by fathom" and don't say "this is a fathom lens" .

Actually even LM says the same thing: "Additional Optics include a line of Fathom designed lenses" (http://www.uwimaging.com/bluefin-optics.php) which is different from saying "Additional Optics include a line of Fathom lenses". The confusion is in their table when they name product "fathom 80" (and so on...)

In my case, for WP-80 there's a big difference in the price tag from supplier although the lens is definitely the same. For housing with specific port system, there are generally no choice between suppliers and you'll have to follow the housing manufacturer road where the price is naturally expected to be the highest possible even if it's from Chinese sources. I don't know the price of real Fathom lenses but maybe it would be even higher than the chinese versions.

I think the real question is to know if there are some optical differences between a "real fathom" lens and the "fathom designed" copy. After all, we don't buy housing to have heavy pieces of branded stuff but to do some images.

I'm not sure what Mr. Remijan's motivations are, but having some insight into the situation, I can offer some clarification.

Universal Optics Manufacturing in Shenzen, China manufactures the lenses (glass) for all current Fathom Imaging lenses. Some of the lenses are assembled in the US and sold directly by Fathom Imaging, and others are marketed to equipment manufacturers as Fathom designed to be sold under their own label. The Light & Motion lenses used optics designed by Fathom Imaging, manufactured by an OEM manufacturer to Light & Motion specification, and fully warranted by Light & Motion. No fraud is committed. Light & Motion are not selling Fathom products, rather Light & Motion products that incorporate Fathom designs.

I have indications in personal correspondence that indicate Mr. Remijan is paid a design royalty on all of these lenses. He has personally endorsed and recommended the company to me in face to face discussions. Slandering them to an end user seems duplicitous.