Locline. Does it always creak?

Davide, as I recall (it's been a while), my Locline perhaps got stiffer with age, not floppier. It was my early plastic Gorillapod light arms that got gradually floppy.

I've never had Locline crack, despite a lot of use.

I'm tempted to try again to adapt Gorillapod for use as light arms, but I've read that the aluminium one snaps after a while in seawater use, and non-umbilical lights have nothing to save them from the abyss. I've also read that more recent plastic Gorillapod doesn't go floppy like my old one, so that might be an option. Making connectors for the ends is the difficult part.

What brand of clamps do you have? I know I-Das had problem, ULCS clamps are great. If your clamp/arm flop due to aging, I think it's time to change the O-ring because they no long give enough cushion for the clamp to grip. Have you try replace the O-ring on the arm using this?

 

http://reefphoto.com/shop/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=135_97_37&products_id=5458

They're Nauticam. I don't think that changing the O-ring will make much difference. They still seem pretty fresh. But I'll get hold of some next time I visit the shop. I'll also try and check out some ULCS clamps. Maybe the original is the best.

I normally use ULCS arms, but i agree with OP that continous positioning of clam arms is annoying.

I used 3/4 Locline arms and i most likely will buy another set for my small Nauticam LX100 rig as i use it mostly

while guiding to document special moments and often i don't have time to position the clamps and bending a locline arm is much quicker.

Also the vantage of Locline arms is that you can bend them around your housing to streamline the rig and that is important as i usually have it tucked under my armpit.
Another vantage is that you quickly can break them apart (and reconnect them) to use the strobe/lamp to illuminate from back or other far positions.

Regarding creak, yes they do creak, some more and some less and there is not very much to do. Silicon or dry Teflon spray may help with creak, but i fear that it will make them floppy.
Keep in mind that Locline elemets can be bought inexpensive as they are basically a rigid hose and often used to feed cooling fluid on milling machines and there are several types of them.
the only parts you need is the adapter to your tray and the adapter to your strobe or video light, more elements can be found in (online) tool shops

Davide DB: i think that Locline arms will bend/turn back on your scooter

Chris

 

Regarding creak, yes they do creak, some more and some less and there is not very much to do. Silicon or dry Teflon spray may help with creak, but i fear that it will make them floppy.

Keep in mind that Locline elemets can be bought inexpensive as they are basically a rigid hose and often used to feed cooling fluid on milling machines and there are several types of them.

the only parts you need is the adapter to your tray and the adapter to your strobe or video light, more elements can be found in (online) tool shops

 

Davide DB: i think that Locline arms will bend/turn back on your scooter

 

I saw them on several industrial furniture web sites but I recall that my uw photo shop has different brands and they are slightly different.

For scooter use, sad news I have to check for some feedback on some technical dive forum...

 

I'm tempted to try again to adapt Gorillapod for use as light arms, but I've read that the aluminium one snaps after a while in seawater use, and non-umbilical lights have nothing to save them from the abyss. I've also read that more recent plastic Gorillapod doesn't go floppy like my old one, so that might be an option. Making connectors for the ends is the difficult part.

Nick, why you want to adapt Gorillapod and not use simple locline parts? Are they different?

Nick, why you want to adapt Gorillapod and not use simple locline parts? Are they different?

Because of the noise! They creak (not "crack") when you move them like a very loud door in a haunted house. Fellow divers don't like it and some marine life doesn't either.

Locline is hollow. Gorillapod is solid and doesn't creak.

That's useful info Dustin.

Where did you get that Locline that didn't creak much? I have a feeling that new Locline might be a little quieter as it may still be a little slippery from the manufacturing process (injection mould release agent etc.).

And what brand of clamps are you using? Mine are Nauticam. Perhaps some are smoother than others. I wish manufacturers would offer them with a finer thread for finer control over the tension. However that would make them slower to assemble.

Nick,

I got them from backscatter. They creak more out of the water than in. I really think it's the ikelite to locline adaptor that made the movement. And I also agree, that the newness of it may have made it quieter. I also only did the small solas on them, I wouldn't do the 4000's on them.

As for clamps, I use the Ulcs clamps and arms. To be honest I kind of man handle them underwater, I don't have a ton of patience so I keep all connections stiff, and then muscle it into place when I see a subject. This also creaks because it is tighter.

I also force my tripod legs, and have had to but new ball for the base of my tripod because I tweak them hard underwater without loosening much. Movement is nice, but the stability I think wins out for me on the arms. However, I think a lot depends on what you are used to.

Dustin

Hi Nick,

It's a shame that we did not meet in Lembeh last week because then I could have shown you my new light arms.

I used Locline for many years but was always annoyed by the creaking. Worse than that problem, after a lot of use, the arms became less firm and could move in a strong current, adding a wobble and a creak to the footage. But, as you say, the ability to quickly reposition the lights without undoing bolts is important when shooting in a rapidly changing situation.

Then, on a dive boat earlier this year, I saw some flexible arms that seemed much better. David Cheung of ScubaCam said they come from 10-Bar and he got me a pair of 36cm arms. They have a 5mm t-mount for the camera (fits out of the box on the GH4) and a YS-Mount on the top end.

I just used them on 15 dives - a couple of times in mild to strong current. They hold their position solidly, especially underwater.

I can't say if they'll get looser with wear over time but they were not that expensive so you could just get new ones when that happens.

Regards

Peter

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Sorry about creak vs crack. I meant creak. I have owned the 10 bar arms I bought a set long time ago at cameras underwater. http://camerasunderwater-co-uk.mporium.io/product/2344

The positive is that they are really strong and there is a piece of cord inside and integrated YS style end. The negative is that they don't bend as much as locline and whilst they resist age better they are really stiff in water and not much better than ball and clamp. The 10bar come with 5mm but although you can get a 45 cm arm the first 4 segments don't flex so effectively locline plus handle is longer it same.

For me is either 1/2" locline that is really flexible or ball and clamp. 3/4 locline is not more flexible to warrant use and limited in length although much lighter than ball and clamp at same length.

Sorry about creak vs crack. I meant creak. I have owned the 10 bar arms I bought a set long time ago at cameras underwater. http://camerasunderwater-co-uk.mporium.io/product/2344

The positive is that they are really strong and there is a piece of cord inside and integrated YS style end. The negative is that they don't bend as much as locline and whilst they resist age better they are really stiff in water and not much better than ball and clamp. The 10bar come with 5mm but although you can get a 45 cm arm the first 4 segments don't flex so effectively locline plus handle is longer it same.

For me is either 1/2" locline that is really flexible or ball and clamp. 3/4 locline is not more flexible to warrant use and limited in length although much lighter than ball and clamp at same length.

They are really stiff in water and not much better than ball and clamp.

Not true. The 10-bar flexi-arms are much more positionable than ball and clamp. They are stiff enough to hold their position but flexible enough to be easily moved into most lighting positions from WA to CU. I just used them on 15 dives and had no problems with them, shooting both macro and wide.

The 45cm version is intended for mounting on a tray where the lower segments are the handle. For the GH4 housing, with the arms mounted on the top of the handles, 36cm is about the right length.

They do make a noise when repositioned but not that haunted-house creak of the Locline.

Regards

Peter

Not true. The 10-bar flexi-arms are much more positionable than ball and clamp. They are stiff enough to hold their position but flexible enough to be easily moved into most lighting positions from WA to CU. I just used them on 15 dives and had no problems with them, shooting both macro and wide.

 

The 45cm version is intended for mounting on a tray where the lower segments are the handle. For the GH4 housing, with the arms mounted on the top of the handles, 36cm is about the right length.

 

They do make a noise when repositioned but not that haunted-house creak of the Locline.

 

Regards

Peter

All versions have the first four segments locked to be used as handles and don't flex

I have compared side to side with locline and at comparable length it bends less. than 3/4" locline. Also 15 dives is not a good metric. I used them for over 100 dives: because they can't be disassembled easily the started wearing out and could not be cleaned net result they started to fall off or rotate to given position and noise wise got as noisy as locline. Another problem is that the screw of the mount starts getting rust on it and so does the internal one that keeps the line inside. Generally shops consider here the 10bar as a cheap starter solution and only valid as locline costs more at the camera shop (but not at the garden shop if you are happy with orange or blue)

For me ball and clamp once loosened after you are in the water become much easier and precise to position than locline or 10bar copy 3/4". We all have preferences and make experiments I have had the 10bar, locline 3/4", 1/2" and ball and clamp. My preferred are 1/2" locline they are easy to position and make no noise however are quite short and only work with lights that are less than 250 circa second ball and clamp. The main advantage of ball is that you can far exceed 12" in length no flex arm can do that safely although you may take a risk

Worse than that problem, after a lot of use, the arms became less firm

I suggested to Mr Cheung that we could try Viagara but he thought that it would not work underwater unless a mermaid swam by.

If it creaks try some lube :)

I am looking at some old world goose neck lamps. Not the lamp but the bendy metal part. I have not found one that could resist sea water. I think the new "metal" Gorilla-pod could be hacked and butchered into video light arms. If I found one that works as well then I will let you know.

cheers

I think the new "metal" Gorilla-pod could be hacked and butchered into video light arms. If I found one that works as well then I will let you know.

When I did that with early plastic Gorillapod it was a dream to use for a few dives until the joints went floppy. But others have had no problems maintaining stiffness in theirs used as tripods. On the other hand thetrickster had his metal Gorillapod crack and break after 3 dives, so that doesn't seem like a long-term solution either. I guess saltwater gets trapped inside it. Of the two, I think the heaviest duty plastic Gorillapod would probably be the better bet, and hope that it maintains stiffness longer than my previous effort did. Here it was with everything stowed away.

The next challenge, at least for me, would be finding somewhere for the buoyancy to go if the flex arms take over the ball mounts on the housing. I have 2 Inon Mega floats in all my configurations (facebook pic).

On reflection, I think I'm going to get a pair of 14" "Flex Arm with Ball Mount and YS Mount" made by Beneath The Surface (available here, here or here) and mount them to the top end of my mega floats, and put up with any creaking. They could also be mounted at the bottom end of the float arm via triple ball clamps, in which case the clamps could probably be left clamped solid for the whole dive, with the floats pointing upwards, as they usually are now, and the flex arms pointing roughly forwards/outwards. There is also a 21"-long version but I think 14" will be just enough. I wonder if I can feed some sort of security rope or wire through it to hold my Keldans if the Locline breaks apart.

Peter, do you have any external buoyancy on your GH4 macro rig?