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That description is correct. I would ask have you ever used lens like the 28-60 with a diopter? You can achieve 0.7x at 83mm , but it only shows a focused image between 83 and 135mm and much outside that range it’s really blurred. It works but it is not the same as using a macro lens. Housings can be hard to aim sometimes and with a true macro you can back up, find the subject and keep focusing as you move in . Basically easier to use . You can produce nice images with both, but a dedicated macro lens is always going to be sharper. The macro plus MFO3 gives flexibility to shoot critters from 5-10mm size all the way up to about 300-500mm.

Thank you for taking the time to explain. The examples you listed made it easier for me to understand focus-distance gaps and how it affects shooting.

28-60mm alone is already a medium to narrow lens. I have the 14-42mm (M43 hence 28-84mm) and CMC-2. Adding a CMC-2 you definitely go in medium macro territory. But don't confuse this configuration with a true macro lens. I made the same mistake naively years ago. I had the WWL and buying a single flip with the CMC-2 was the obvious choice. But if you look at the port chart you notice you have a focus/distance gap. The MFD of the 14-42mm is much greater than the focus range of the CMC-2. And you're therefore forced to be very careful about distances from your subjects. For example, my 14-42mm has a MFD of 20 cm at 14 and 30 cm at 42mm. For example you have a nudibranch at 20 cm from you. You're at 42mm and you can't focus on it but if you put on the CMC-2 it's not in focus anyway and you have to get closer between 77 and 122 mm. Depending on the subject and situation it could be really annoying. I also have a 45mm (90 FF) on which I mount the CMC-2 with the flip and for macro it's a completely different sport. Sure you don't do medium subjects but from small to fairly advanced macro you cover all sizes and distances. Now I don't want to dismiss this configuration that I still use and consider a jack of all trades. But it's not ideal like it was often recommended years ago.

duplicate post, please delete.

Apologies, I am a newbie and not familiar with the ratio terminology. Nauticam lists the CMC-1 and 2 as options to be used with the 28-60. I assumed this is to shorten the minimum focus distance at 60 for macro like performance. I thought the MFO-3 was designed to be used with 100mm macro lenses to create a system to mimic 50-60mm macro lenses because some subjects are too large for 100mm and existing 50-60mm macro lenses autofocus poorly. I own the 28-60 lens and flat port for use with the WWL for wide angle shooting. It would be nice if the 28-60 could also be used for medium to narrow angle shooting by adding the CMC-2. It is certainly more compact than the 100mm MFO-3 combination. I just do not know how the 2 setups compare optically or in ease of use.

On Sony you need the 35.5mm N120 adapter plus the DP100T for N120. I wouldn't buy the DP100 new, I'd look for a 140mm port instead. But the DP100 show up used fairly often.

This comparison is hardly apples to apples. The CMC-2 is designed to magnify or narrow the angle of view while the MFO-3/MV60 are designed to reduce magnification or widen AOV. The difference with 28-60mm at 60mm is minimum focus distance is around 40cm while the Nauticam MFO-3 and the Marelux MV60 focus all the way to the glass, so 0 cm. The 28-60 at 60mm will focus to infinity, the Marelux will focus to infinity and the Nauticam will focus to 150cm. A better comparison would be that the Sony 100mm macro will focus to 1.4:1 while the 28/60 at 60mm with CMC-2 willl be more like 1:1.75 on full frame. The CMC-1 has more magnification and will get to about 1:1.2/3.

See here at the Nauticam port charts: https://drive.google.com/file/d/1caMOa2cyCxucdcAiI8q9UsUu1YEg9ImC/view #1.: Sony 28-60mm & CMC-2: max. magnification: 0,7x Working Distance 83-135mm #2.: Sony 100mm macro & MFO-3: Max. Magnification 0.9X Working Distance 0-1500mm => Sony 28-60mm & CMC-2 is the macro that you can achieve, but you get 28mm WA behind planboard w/o CMC-2. Opposed to this you get a dedicated macro lens with the bare Sony 100mm GM, that you can convert to approx. 60mm focal length by adding the MFO-3 (= similar to Sony 28-60mm @ 60mm). (The announced Marelux wetlens may convert the Sony 100mm into a corrected (= like domeport) 24mm WA lens, but it seems it is not available yet, nor did I see any real tests of IQ yet).

My wife is using the Tokina 10-17mm with Nauticam housing for Olympus EM1II plus Metabones 0,71x speedbooster with Zen DP100 (N120 version). In addition, she uses N85/N120 34,7mm Nauticm adapter plus 20mm N120 extension... => this is indeed a perfect and compact rig for UW WA... Regarding pedal hood: The hood is in the way, when the Tokina is used on FF cameras (not recommended, better use e.g. Canon 8-15mm with 1x glassless adapter then (if required)). FF people used to remove this hood then( not recommended, better use e.g. Canon 8-15mm with 1x glassless adapter then (if adapter is required)). A bigger image circle (compared to APSC) is required for FF sensor, the pedal hood already shows up...

Aloha and welcome @hon05

This is a comparison between the Nauticam and the Marelux being used by Tom Kline and others. AOV range, weight both in and out of water, and focus range are some of the differences as well as lens design.

I dive out of Eilat a lot (northern Red Sea), so different routes than a Hurghada liveaboard, but the same water type. Agree this is mostly wide-angle country for that itinerary. Wrecks and reef walls are the main show. If you're thinning the bag after Indonesia, leave the macro kit home. I shoot a phone in a housing and a GoPro with no strobes, which forces the keep-it-simple habit. What I'd actually want on a Red Sea boat: a camera you can grab every dive without fuss, a spare battery or two, and hands free for buoyancy. Agree with the two-wetsuits tip already in the thread for November. Beyond that I'd rather leave options I won't open at home.

I've been happily playing with my new gear (Sony A6400, Tokina 10-17mm in a Saltedline housing with a 6 inches dome port) in the few dives I could do during the summer, here in Marseille. I invested in good strobes (Sea&Sea YS-D3 Duo) which I'm happy with, but less so with the housing. No flooding concerns, but the buttons are squishy and work only half the time (when they work at all...). Thus, I'm looking into getting a Nauticam housing plus a 100 zen dome port. Looking into the used market, but getting lost with port diameter sizes, extensions and the rest ! Do you use your Tokina with a FF body or APS-C ?

Has anyone done a comparision between these 2 setups ? I see good reviews for the 100mm with MFO-3, but not much on the 28-60 with CMC-2. For larger macro and medium size subjects, how do these setups compare ?

Hi hon05 A warm welcome to Waterpixels. Great to have you with us. We hope you enjoy the forum and find all the help you need. Post away! Best wishes

Update - I was told it's revised glass, they don't seem to be claiming any improvement for it.

Thanks for the welcome. I'll dig into that ambient-light action-cam article. Phone in a housing and a GoPro with no strobes, so that's exactly the mess I'm usually looking at.

the old MFO3 spec: and the new: specs seem identical??

I saw on the Nauticam homepage, that they are selling now MFO-3II: https://www.nauticam.com/products/mid-range-focus-optimizer-3-mfo-3 Does anybody know what the difference to the original MFO-3 is?

Hi, just joined the forum. Im looking to share and discuss improvements I´m doing to my R50 seafrogs kit. So ill be mostly in the Tutorials, How-Tos, DIY forum.

Hmmm, or Hong Kong as there are no sales taxes and then come home via Bali...😄