Nemrod

She used the word "epic-ness" and at which point, despite taking Dramamine, I barfed 🤮.

Curious, what upper cross piece is that?

Yes, Inon, YS strobes can be set for preflash or no preflash for manual strobe operation. As well, both can run a standard slave mode TTL. TTL requires a preflash in order to function. Sony cameras, those we are discussing, cannot cancel preflash (like Canon, Oly, Nikon can) and thus you must have one of these things to run manual strobes: A strobe like YS, Inon, Backscatter that has a preflash, no preflash selector mode for manual operation A trigger board that can ignore the preflash and properly sync (UWT) Something other than a darn Sony that can be set to not have a preflash Most if not nearly all with a few exceptions run manual strobes using TTL for special or niche uses. I claim no expertise as a photographer and I find TTL occasionally useful but hardly a Godsend. In fact, it can be rather annoying as it tends to give a very generic result and I spend more time trying to adjust the TTL bias to get the result I see in my head than if I were to just run in manual (and probably still not get what I think I want).

LOL, one last thing, to repeat, the Sony cameras we are discussing cannot cancel preflash for manual strobe operation. You either have to use a trigger board like the UWT or perhaps the AOI built in (?) or you have to have a strobe that can cancel preflash like the Inon, YS, Backscatter etc. for manual strobe support.

To be clear, the Marelux Apollo, unlike Inon and YS and Backscatter, does not have a preflash cancel selection. You can run them in manual (and sTTL) with a Sony camera with a trigger board. Without a trigger board and using a pop up flash the Apollo S strobes trigger on the preflash. And Backscatter is the opposite, there is no slave TTL mode or any TTL capability without their special trigger! They require a proprietary trigger board $$$$$. But they do have preflash cancel so manual operation is a cinch! using my UWT trigger or the pop up flash. Just no slave TTL without a trigger board. Which if I may say, sucks.

Strobe triggers are expensive, this is an expensive "hobby" and that is what they cost. And IMO, strobe trigger boards are not reliable but others have had different experiences than me with them. I think AOI has some built in triggers in their housings. Just me perhaps, but I would not purchase that Sony A7 for UW photography with strobes. It has a slow 1/160 shutter speed and no ability to (without a trigger board$$$$) cancel the preflash. You will not be able to shoot manual strobes without a trigger board. The 1/160 slow shutter sync is a handicap, not a huge one and I have been able to deal with it. Where I come up against this limitation with Sony A series cameras is WA into the sun, sun balls and CFWA with bright backgrounds and also high ambient light. My Sony A6400, using the UWT trigger board can eek out 1/200 but it is kind of a PITA to set up. IMO, I will never purchase an UW camera rig that cannot do 1/250 strobe sync snd which cannot cancel preflash for manual strobes. Not to overly confuse you but strobes such as Inon, YS, that have a pre-flash cancel can run from the Sony pop up for manual strobe operation because they have a selector mode to ignore the preflash. The Marelux Apollo strobes do not, at least the set I used did not.

I do not believe this to be true. I used a set of Marelux Apollo S strobes for two weeks on both my Sony A6400 and my Canon R50. Both in Nauticam. My Sony has a UW Technics trigger and the pop up flash. I ran the Marelux strobes from both the UWT trigger and from the pop up flash in TTL. I also ran the strobes in TTL from the R50 using the pop up flash. Unless something has changed the Marelux strobes have a standard slave TTL mode. What the Marelux strobes do not have is a pre-flash cancel so I cannot run them in manual from the pop up with the Sony A6400 (I can using the UWT trigger) because the Sony cameras always have a preflash. The Canon can turn the pre-flash off for manual operation of the Marelux strobes.

The Marelux strobes worked just fine and dandy with my Sony A6400 Nauticam both using the pop up flash as trigger and a (LED) UWT trigger. And in both configurations the TTL worked well as did manual. They are a very solid and strong shooting strobe with high build quality being all metal, also perhaps a little on the heavier side though nothing unusual for the power output. The Backscatter strobes will not work for TTL because they have no slave TTL without buying their special Backscatter trigger and even then I am doubtful. Manual modes should work but there is no slave TTL mode. Otherwise, aside, they look like a good strobe. The YS strobes should work in both TTL (slave mode) and manual modes.

Been to Cozumel many times and never paid a tax including twice last year. However, there is a report now on Scubaboard of two persons paying upwards of $500. Per this (sketchy) report one had two systems and the other had a nauticam, a GoPro and a camera with a phone!. Here is the thing, I have been asked how many cameras I have and my answer is an honest one camera. If I start going on about a GoPro, a phone and whatnot who knows what the result might be. Also, I have not gotten the "red button" in any more recent trips. Another unknown.

Thanks I saw mention of S1 and S2 but no explanation of what they are. I am just thinking, exploring options none of which seem attractive to me. I am sitting on a pile of money earmarked for strobes but not a strobe exists that I am satisfied with. I am of the mind I will not pay for a strobe that has RC/Sony only modes and no slave TTL. Like WTH! Or they are big enough and heavy enough to serve as a boat anchor and put my airline weight limits to the test! I am a manual shooter but slave TTL is useful at times and I have spending $2000 plus on strobes without that capability and modes I have no use for. My rant for the evening. If Retra could shrink the Maxi (?) to a Midi and say it ran about $1,000 per unit I could get excited. If it had slave TTL.

A quick question that perusing the OM did not satisfy. There is no mention of a pre-flash cancel, does this strobe have that capability? I understand this is a full manual only strobe, nonetheless I need a pre-flash cancel mode.

Same here, lack of a slave TTL mode is pretty much a no go for me also. I would buy the HF-1 or the new Atom but for one thing, no slave TTL. My Sony and my Canon neither support RC or the Sony (RC) modes and will work only in a manual mode with those strobes. And whatever triggers Backscatter offers do not work with either camera system. Not everyone shoots Olympus or a TJunk, seems to be a blaring omission to me. The DS130 might be a go but YS strobes seem to have issues with reliability.

I like that the YS130 retains standard TTL capability. Not sure about the size of the thing and that digital panel, I would rather just have a dial with numbers. Are these made in Japan?

Too bad our digital cameras do not get updated to the latest technology by purchasing a new roll of film. It is not the housing that cause the depreciation, it is the never ending "improvements" to cameras that is driving the obsolesce of the cameras, lenses and thus the housings for them. Once upon a time computers were sold by processor speed, this is 166MHz, then 200MHz and now it is not really relevant as a shopping metric. Maybe someday cameras will have resolution that exceeds the optical resolution of the human eye and the capability of the human brain to discern any difference. Then maybe there will not be a new and better model every few months.

Yes, you should. If you get an answer please let us know. I have shot MF-2 strobes with my Sony A6400 setting the UWT trigger board to 0 and using the learning function for the MF-2 strobes and of course with the strobes set to Manual. I wonder as well if he will in the future include Backscatter OM/Sony as a switch selection and as well if existing boards could be updated for that functionality.

I am pretty sure the UWT trigger board will support Backscatter strobes for manual use only. That would be UWT switch position 0. The UWT board will not support the Backscatter strobes in TTL mode as they use some sort of proprietary coding, at least my UWT board will not.

It does pertain to this thread because the Back Scatter strobes are not compatible with many popular Sony A series cameras for TTL. The A6300 and A6400 being one of them. The Backscatter strobes do have a Manual preflash cancel thus Manual strobe shooting is supported but cannot do TTL.

If asking me, I cannot say. If it was meant as an argument I still cannot say. I do know that WL Command does not seem to turn off the preflash on my A6400. I use the UWT trigger, if I want manual with no preflash signal I set 0 on the UWT board. If I want TTL I select the position on the strobe matching or nearest the strobes I have. I would hazard a guess that the Back Scatter trigger plugged into the hot shoe translates, using built in software, between the camera hot shoe output signals and the Backscatter strobes via optical signals over the fiber cables. And just to say it again, I do not know. Maybe it is a question for Back Scatter to explain. I am satisfied with plain old optical TTL which the Backscatter strobes do not have. But that Inon, YS, Marelux, Retra (?) do have.

I know, I keep hearing how there are so many strobes, YAFS sort of thing. And I suppose considering the niche segment nature of UW photography there is a decent selection but many of them are just rebranding with a little shake and stir of features. And this new (non) feature of not including a standard optical TTL mode and pushing us to specialty branded triggers specific to the strobe (Back Scatter) is already getting old.

I am surprised Backscatter does not know and understand that none of their namesake strobes will support simple standard optical TTL using the camera flash as trigger. The Atom will support manual with and without a preflash but cannot run TTL. TTL is only possible with Oly RC mode or Sony WL Command. Which is sort of chintzy and disappointing and my current hang up with buying a pair. Unless I am reading the manuals wrong.

Make that three for curious.

I do not see that you are accomplishing much by removing and leaving your focus light behind. Mine is useful for minor penetrations, night dives where it sometimes becomes my main light and for signaling. Focus is just part of why it is useful. My light is the Kraken also. Mounted atop the housing in the cold shoe. And, yes, it is sometimes useful for focus. My cameras seem quite capable of focusing most of the time without assist but now and then ----.

The NA-R50 uses a (rubber) sleeve that is integral to the fixed port to grip the lens as the camera slides into the housing and port.

Perfect solution for over under shots! Is it April?

I guess the lack of a modeling light limits snoot use for the S220? It certainly has the bayonet to accept accessories. The Atom flash is probably where I am headed and just have to live with Manual only with all three of my cameras.