My current setup is the Olympus EM10 in the AOI housing, with the 60mm lens and a single MF-2 flash. I'm really happy with the results with smaller subjects and am sure I have a long way to go getting better with just this configuration. I also really appreciate how small the rig is - very casual to dive with and easy for travel.

But I find I'm struggling with larger subjects - reef squid, octopus, seahorses, even bigger nudibranchs. It's hard to get the whole thing in frame, and at the distance I need to be I often don't have enough light. Definitely true for turtles, rays etc.

I'm curious if there's a setup that can manage fish portrait of even some bigger species through to macro on the same dive. I'd definitely be fine with it not covering wide angle. I'd be happy to consider changing formats/camera bodies too. I only really view pictures digitally so don't need super high megapixels in case a compact is one of the good options.

I was considering something like the 12-40 zoom with a wet lens if anyone has tried it, but curious to hear recommendations of any kind!

The newly released Nauticam MFO-3 does just this, it increases the field of view of macro lenses. In your case it would be the equivalent of about a 35mm macro lens. It is not available just yet, but due very soon. Attaches either with a bayonet of flip adapter or M67 thread. I've ordered one as I have the same issue as you with seahorses, larger fish, weedy sea dragons etc. You would need to check compatibility with your AOI port.

Your other alternative might be either a 12-40 or 12-45 lens in a small dome. The 12-40 achieves 0.3x at max zoom, which is about 55-60mm across the frame, but it gets significantly wider field than the MFO-3. These lenses won't work well with a wet lens as they extend when they zoom.

A third alternative is the WWL type setup using one of the 14-42 lenses, but this doesn't get as much magnification as you can get with 12-40 lens

Wow the MFO-3 on a flip sounds fantastic. Having the full magnification of the 60mm available with an option to jump wider is more or less exactly what I was hoping for.

I'll look into the ports for this!

Have you considered a 30mm macro? I had significantly better luck with things like turtles and bigger fish compared to the 60mm macro, but of course you give up working distance (and the ability to use diopters). I have a proper short port for the 30mm on order and will see if that lets me do acceptable macro (if not super-macro) on my next trip. I'm not sure it checks all your boxes, but it would be super compact and light (and potentially cheaper), compared to 60mm+MFO-3.

I should mention that I have also used the 12-45 in a semi-dome port. It's not even a slightly scientific comparison, because I mainly shot with the 60mm, but of the the images I took on a recent 2 week trip, only one of the keepers was at the 45mm end. I did keep a couple "close focus wide angle" style shots at 18mm and wider [1]. I think it is possible I may get better at those, but the focus distance at 45mm is just too long for macro (at least if you are used to the 60mm).

[1]: https://www.mu-43.com/threads/olympus-12-45mm-f-4-pro.107818/page-19#post-1796213

Edited Monday at 10:53 AM1 day by d2b

I second the above re 30mm macro has a happy middle ground.

I often use my 30mm while carrying two wet lenses in caddies on my housing cross bar. An AOI UWL-09 wide angle wet lens and a AOI UCL-05 diopter. The 30mm gives me a fish-portrait style width and decent macro then I can add the diopter to the 30mm for closer macro. Then with a swap to the wide angle wet lens I get a FOV better for bigger subjects like sharks. It's the combo that covers just about everything.

Many of the pics on my site were taken with the 30mm and wide angle wet lens.

https://mikejonesdive.com/gallery

The 60mm is a great lens but really no use for anything other than macro.

15 minutes ago, MikeJonesDive said:

I second the above re 30mm macro has a happy middle ground.

I often use my 30mm while carrying two wet lenses in caddies on my housing cross bar. An AOI UWL-09 wide angle wet lens and a AOI UCL-05 diopter. The 30mm gives me a fish-portrait style width and decent macro then I can add the diopter to the 30mm for closer macro. Then with a swap to the wide angle wet lens I get a FOV better for bigger subjects like sharks. It's the combo that covers just about everything.

Many of the pics on my site were taken with the 30mm and wide angle wet lens.

https://mikejonesdive.com/gallery

The 60mm is a great lens but really no use for anything other than macro.

Do you use the 30mm macro lens behind a domeport, for best IQ, rather than a flatport?

I am not sure (careful reviews have yet to come), but likely the MFO-3 gives IQ comparable to a domeport - then the Zuiko 60mm +/- MFO-3 provides not only more flexibility, but also better IQ (of course no real WA at the same dive)...

I have the 30mm macro, the Panasonic version, nice lens but I find the practical limit for it is about 0.5x, theoretically it does 1:1 but this is achieved about 10-15mm or so from the front port glass, hard to get that close and also light your subject. It does indeed work well for medium size subjects and I've taken some nice shots with it. But for me if you also want to shoot smaller stuff in the 0.5 - 1.0x range it doesn't cut it. I couldn't imagine using a diopter with it as it focuses so close already.

The MFO-3 allows you to have the 60mm 1:1 capable lens and a 35mm approx lens on the same dive, much greater flexibility. In Australia at least the required port plus the lens purchased new for Nauticam would be more expensive than the MFO-3.

6 hours ago, d2b said:

Have you considered a 30mm macro? I had significantly better luck with things like turtles and bigger fish compared to the 60mm macro, but of course you give up working distance (and the ability to use diopters). I have a proper short port for the 30mm on order and will see if that lets me do acceptable macro (if not super-macro) on my next trip. I'm not sure it checks all your boxes, but it would be super compact and light (and potentially cheaper), compared to 60mm+MFO-3.

I should mention that I have also used the 12-45 in a semi-dome port. It's not even a slightly scientific comparison, because I mainly shot with the 60mm, but of the the images I took on a recent 2 week trip, only one of the keepers was at the 45mm end. I did keep a couple "close focus wide angle" style shots at 18mm and wider [1]. I think it is possible I may get better at those, but the focus distance at 45mm is just too long for macro (at least if you are used to the 60mm).

[1]: https://www.mu-43.com/threads/olympus-12-45mm-f-4-pro.107818/page-19#post-1796213

I think the 12-45’s small footprint and reasonable close focusing capabilities make it a good general purpose lens if you like making fish portraits and even larger creatures. It’s a 24-90mm equivalent, and underwater the smaller f4 aperture matters less with artificial light. Plus, almost all cameras now are so much better such that ISO sensitivities matter less, meaning push the hell out of your ISOs!

For medium portrait and fish Inlove the Panasonic 12-35mm with the 6" dome port.

As example, this video was entirely filmed with it.

The size of the filmed John Dory fish goes from a ping pong paddle to a tennis racket. And, as I have written several times, the lens with the simple 6-inch acrylic dome port is tack sharp. It's easy to find it used and I love it very much ❤️

4 hours ago, Davide DB said:

For medium portrait and fish Inlove the Panasonic 12-35mm with the 6" dome port.

As example, this video was entirely filmed with it.

The size of the filmed John Dory fish goes from a ping pong paddle to a tennis racket. And, as I have written several times, the lens with the simple 6-inch acrylic dome port is tack sharp. It's easy to find it used and I love it very much ❤️

Beautifully done. My kind of video!

Love the video! Really shows the range too.

Thanks for all the recommendations! A lot of options all with the same camera/housing which is great. So in practice it sounds like I can cover one of two partially overlapping ranges at a time. A 12-45 or 12-35 with a dome port for quite wide up to not quite macro. Or the MFO-3 and 60mm for full macro with an option to capture bigger subjects.

And then the 30mm standalone as maybe a sweet spot in the middle ground.

Has anyone tried the 30mm btw with AOI's FLP06 and an extension ring? It's very tempted to add this in if I don't need a dedicated port for it. I did confirm I can use the MFO-3 with my existing setup. The zoom lenses will need a new port of course

1 hour ago, braven said:

Love the video! Really shows the range too.

Thanks for all the recommendations! A lot of options all with the same camera/housing which is great. So in practice it sounds like I can cover one of two partially overlapping ranges at a time. A 12-45 or 12-35 with a dome port for quite wide up to not quite macro. Or the MFO-3 and 60mm for full macro with an option to capture bigger subjects.

And then the 30mm standalone as maybe a sweet spot in the middle ground.

Has anyone tried the 30mm btw with AOI's FLP06 and an extension ring? It's very tempted to add this in if I don't need a dedicated port for it. I did confirm I can use the MFO-3 with my existing setup. The zoom lenses will need a new port of course

Looking at the port chart you use a 24mm extension with the FLP-04 or a 34 mm extension with the FLP-06 for the 60mm macro lens meaning the FLP-06 port is around 10mm shorter than the FLP-04 port. The chart also suggests the FLP-04 port for the 30mm macro and this implies the FLP-06 port alone won't fit the 30mm macro lens as it would be too short. You could use the port combination for the 60mm macro but the 30mm macro is shorter by 25mm which means the minimum focusing distance for the 30mm would fall inside the port, which means that 1:1 is not possible at ll and the max magnification you can easily use is lower.

The FLP-06 alone would house the 14-42 EZ lens which might be a cheaper possibility, it's probably not the sharpest knife in the drawer but should be acceptable. You can zoom out to 14mm but the image quality will suffer in the corners due to the flat port at the wider end. Zooming in you can achieve about 0.23x magnification maximum meaning it will cover an area 74mm wide. You can add a wet lens diopter - the Nauticam CMC-2 focuses between 63 and 130mm and can get up to 0.6x - usable but not anywhere near as convenient as dedicated 1:1 macro lens.

The MFO-3 of course allows you to get the 35mm macro and 60mm macro on the same dive, both with very good optical quality.

I own the Oly 30mm, and don't use it as much as I could/should. As others have said, it's a versatile lens for a range of subjects, and does have a very short working distance. All shots below (and my profile pic) are taken with it. They're uncropped unless stated, and show a range of subject sizes. The nudi and froggie were taken with one strobe. Wish I'd had more time with the eggs than the end of a dive snapshot, as could really have got some better detail.

Its short working distance makes it challenging for shooting tiny, skittish subjects (where I use the 90mm), but you can crop and still retain quite a lot of acceptable detail, e.g the coral goby.

For the price point the 30mm is a really good lens, and for pure macro I find it sharpest at f13-16 (all pics are f13/16 except the nudi at f6.3). As it is that much cheaper, you can see a bit of colour fringing, but nothing that Lightroom can't rectify. I'm not familiar with AOI ports etc. so can't comment on price comparison for any required ports/ extension rings etc. vs options suggested by others.

I also use the Oly 14-42 pancake lens with a Nauticam Wet Wide lens, which gives a much wider FOV. That allows both wide angle (up to 130 degree FOV) and macro on the same dive, but it's a really heavy and pricey combo, and you need a willing buddy/ lens caddy to stow the WWL, and to remember to 'burp' it. That's my go to set up, but I rarely take the lens off, tbh, as the 14-42 is not in the same ballpark as the 30, 60 or 90 for macro (yes, I own all three... guilty of GAS right there).

Hope that helps,

Justin

I think for the AOI, the port and lens will be a bit cheaper than the MFO-3 plus flip adapter. I use the 30 a lot and can shoot relatively big things if the water is clear. On our recent Sea of Cortez trip I got some nice sea lion shots with the 30.

Bill