Sonyworld: startling differences in RAW interpretation between Sony and Adobe softwares

[RomiK]

Not sure if it's the right forum but this seems to me an infrastructure issue rather than workflow or editing issue. 

 

Has anyone noticed - not only from Sony world but also Canon and Nikon if this issue has been noticed there - startling differences in interpretation - on occasion -  of (fairly high) custom white balanced images (this 33000) between the vendor's own raw processor (in this case Sony) and industry standard like Adobe Lightroom and Camera raw and actually Apple too? I will let pictures talk, I didn't browse images with Sony's software before, always put them through Lightroom and was done with it... It's an engineering issue, nothing we could do about, just curious if anyone run into this

 

Sony Viewer initial view :

 

Sony's metadata view

 

 

Ligtroom initial view

 

Lightroom after moving purple and magenta hues all the way to the left

 

OSX Finder preview - this is how it would turn in Apple photos too:

 

try

[Guest]

This feature is unique to Sony and not many people would have noticed because it requires you to perform a custom white balance that raw shooters normally don't do but other people shooting in ambient light do

The situation is the following you perform a custom white balance in camera and ends with color temperature 9900K and M7 in reality the camera was off the scale with custom white balance the software is not correcting it (camera settings)

If you now go on Imaging Edge and select Creative Look ST which is what you shot the image you will see it turning purple exactly like lightroom. However if you don't touch it it shows the reds you don't see.

This behaviour is unique to Sony and interestingly if you white balance in their own software and apply 9900K M7 equivalent you don't get the same outcome

My explanation is that the camera is actually exceeding 9900K and M7 and not telling you or the software processing it

[RomiK]

Thank you for explanation, makes sense 👍 Very interesting. It seems like that Sony's very own (or contracted) devteam omitted possibility of these high temperature WB when they were creating profiles and then by virtue of APIs this morphed further to other dev teams of other companies... Or perhaps they just officially don't support these higher values as perhaps officially these may not be reliable (similar to what they say about WB with Slog3) and so their published profiles end with 9900 and that's it... It's a shame, I like the colors the most, perhaps will need to export these scenarios from Sony as tiff.

 

Either way it would be interesting so see and compare default output of Canon Nikon and newer Panasonics in these high temp WB situations.

[Guest]

42 minutes ago, RomiK said:

Thank you for explanation, makes sense 👍 Very interesting. It seems like that Sony's very own (or contracted) devteam omitted possibility of these high temperature WB when they were creating profiles and then by virtue of APIs this morphed further to other dev teams of other companies... Or perhaps they just officially don't support these higher values as perhaps officially these may not be reliable (similar to what they say about WB with Slog3) and so their published profiles end with 9900 and that's it... It's a shame, I like the colors the most, perhaps will need to export these scenarios from Sony as tiff.

 

Either way it would be interesting so see and compare default output of Canon Nikon and newer Panasonics in these high temp WB situations.

 

What I can say is that in general terms the interpretation of the program of the 'As shot' differs the image never looks identical to the embedded jpeg. Normally the differences are small.

 

But in those cases the difference is wild.

It is frustrating because the color correction you get in camera is better than you get in post. Now I do not know if this is not the white balance value that is incorrect but something that gets overwritten only on the jpeg and movie file . I may think it is the second if Sony own software cannot give the same results.

 

As I said if you reapply the creative look the image white balance deteriorates which is weird and not good because you have less options on TIFF to do things like noise reduction lens corrections etc etc

 

For what concerns Panasonic this did not happen to me before and I have not encountered this issue elsewhere. Panasonic has a hard limit to 9900K while other brands have a higher limit but none gets to 50K of a RAW converter

[Chris Ross]

The histogram on the SONY page looks quiet different, the blues and greens have peaks in similar spots to lightroom but the reds have a peak much lower.  I'm not sure how you could achieve that with moving the blue-Yellow colour temperature slider and Green-Magenta Tint slider alone.  I use a different method using levels and it seems to work quite well as long as the image is well exposed and has enough red channel to play with.

[Guest]

1 hour ago, Chris Ross said:

The histogram on the SONY page looks quiet different, the blues and greens have peaks in similar spots to lightroom but the reds have a peak much lower.  I'm not sure how you could achieve that with moving the blue-Yellow colour temperature slider and Green-Magenta Tint slider alone.  I use a different method using levels and it seems to work quite well as long as the image is well exposed and has enough red channel to play with.

You cannot get those outcomes even moving the color temperature and tint slider in the sony softwre once you deselect camera settings

In short you can't reproduce what the camera custom white balance did using their own software

Edited March 15 by Interceptor121

[Chris Ross]

10 hours ago, Interceptor121 said:

You cannot get those outcomes even moving the color temperature and tint slider in the sony softwre once you deselect camera settings

In short you can't reproduce what the camera custom white balance did using their own software

Interesting - if I had the RAW file I'd like to have a go using my method using Capture One.

[RomiK]

On 3/16/2024 at 4:53 AM, Chris Ross said:

Interesting - if I had the RAW file I'd like to have a go using my method using Capture One.

I just made it to Maldives southern tip 🤙 will try to upload the file somewhere and post the link. 

[Chris Ross]

6 hours ago, RomiK said:

I just made it to Maldives southern tip 🤙 will try to upload the file somewhere and post the link. 

OK Thanks, if you have google drive it's a good method you just have to set permissions to anyone with the link.